Doc..the left didn’t see Obama as divisive..and that includes the media.
Doc..the left didn’t see Obama as divisive..and that includes the media.
edited for brevity as if I tried to name all members of the lynch mob, I would run out of ink and patience.when elected officials, people elected to run the country spend more time trying to bring down the president than doing their job, that is an issue.
Last edited by dan_bgblue; 09-17-2019 at 08:53 AM.
seeya
dan
I'm just one stomach flu away from my goal weight.
Exactly my point. I saw him as far more divisive. Also far more of an obstructionist. As aggressive to media, and maybe more so (it was under Obama administration that Fox reporter James Rosen was charged). Yes he was a "nice guy" so we will accept all that stuff. Trump on the other hand is a jackass but also a target for the media and an opposing party who won't accept defeat, and go to ANY LEVEL to attack him. That is fine but lets quit with blaming it all on the Donald. I remember a time when the vast majority of Americans would be appauled at the idea of the assination of a president. Now we have a large segment that wish for and would applaud it...and that includes people in our government. I'm tired of the blame it all on Trump. He holds some culpability but not all, or even the majority of it.Originally Posted by Catonahottinroof
Aging is an extraordinary process where you become the person you always should have been.--David Bowie.
I have never seen anything as blatant as the way the National media reacted to Trump's win on election night. They were emotionally destroyed. At that moment they started trashing everything connected to Trump and his supporters.
It is laughable to see people say the hateful rhetoric from both sides needs to stop. The Libs started ALL of this. As a friend of mine said of the Democrats; "it isn't just Trump they hate, it is all the people that support Trump they hate". Personally, I love the fact conservatives are fighting back; I wish they would do it more. I see these videos of people attacking Trump supporters; I say it again, they are not attacking those folks I know. It would end badly for the attackers.
Darryl
Not much more to say then.
~Puma~
This post is exactly why I started this thread.
~Puma~
I feel incredibly sad for our children (and grandchildren). The undertones of violence and threats (on both sides) is becoming alarming.
I see it on Jr. High, High School and college campuses every day.
Discussion, debate and dialogue has been replaced by hatred, anger and threats.
I hate what I see and what it is becoming. Our country is better than this. We, as a people, should be better than this. I hate the constant grenades thrown by the media and the Democratic congress. I hate what twitter has become. I hate the finger pointing that constantly happens on both sides. I hate that anyone questions the legitimacy of an election. I hate that every day there is a new news story about some old story drug up. I hate all of that. And that is all on the Dem side.
But I also hate the racist undertones that I constantly read (it may not be you...but it exists). I hate that a Mexican father in California accidentally killed his son while boating this weekend (he was drinking) and the comment section on Foxnews.com is some of the most disgusting, inflammatory stuff I've ever read. I hate the childish behavior that others look past. I hate that a thread on today's politics and the awful rhetoric that exists predictably turned into finger pointing about "who started it" as opposed to offering solutions to fix it.
My offered solution still stands...BOTH sides need to stop. People need to have civil debates. People need to stop fingerpointing and using extreme hyperbole. And people need to stop pointing out all of the examples of when "the other side" did something and simply do the only thing they can do: monitor their own behavior.
Look, everyone on this board who is not a die-hard conservative or didn't vote for Trump knows better than to attempt to give a different point of view. But the whole 9/11 stuff just really got to me and a lot of this hits home (for several reasons for me).
I don't hate Trump. I certainly don't hate anyone who supports him. I don't think conservatives are "dumb as fenceposts" and I certainly wouldn't vote for a Taliban member before I would vote for a Republican. And I know California has a lot of amazing people in it.
I disagree with many of Trump's policies and I strongly disagree with his antics. He will not be getting my vote.
I love and respect all of you guys on here and since I grew up and was raised as a staunch conservative I certainly understand the basis behind what you all believe.
I just happen to see things differently.
And someday...boy do I hope that someday people will be able to sit down again and have real discussions on real issues without it turning into a circus or even worse. I hope that for my kids.
They are lucky. They go to school every single day on a military base. So, they are exposed to some things most kids their age are not. We respect our military. We respect the office of the President no matter who it is. And we respect the flag and our country (and the rights of others to kneel to it).
But they also hear a lot of racist talk every day. Their school is about 90% white so it is not reflective of the area we are in.
We live in a neighborhood that is 80% hispanic so almost all of their friends and teammates in sports leagues are hispanic. Its personal to them.
So when they hear friends at school talking about the wall and how we need to "send them all back" it hurts them. When they hear kids (and sometimes teachers) talk about how, "They just need to get in line and do it the right way"....they know that those kids and teachers simply are naive. Naive to what "getting in line" actually means.
That we have friends down the street...the kids were born here. The mother is a citizen here. But their dad is "doing the right thing" and living in Tijuana to wait his turn. Its been 17 years now. He's been in front of about every judge, advocate, etc that you can be in front of. We've raised money for his family to hire a lawyer. I've driven the kids down there on weekends to visit with him because they miss their dad. And he waits. Just waits. While his family lives here because she works for a school district and they go to a great school. He's "doing it the right way".
And my kids see that and they hurt for them. They know the only difference between them and those kids is their dad was lucky enough to be born here.
So my kids are lucky. They have been exposed to many cultures and they have learned the value to listening to others points of views. We don't watch news in our house. We don't poison ourselves with Fox or CNN or MSNBC or any other outlet that is simply feeding red/blue meat to the masses to make a buck.
We have gun-toting conservative neighbors. And we have hippy-liberal yoga neighbors. And we have everything in between. And thankfully, when we host 4th of July BBQ's, etc we have a backyard full of every race, every religion, every age and every voting block...and we love (and even like) all of them.
All except the one Duke fan a street over. That M'fer isn't invited.
Peace all. Thanks for the discussion. I am way better over on the basketball side, so I will see you there.
~Puma~
A counter point. My wife is 1/4 Mexican and my kids 1/8th. She grew up in El Paso and her entire family is way more anti-illegal immigration than me. They absolutely believe in people standing in line waiting their turn. I know multiple other Mexicans who feel the same.
It is absurd to think illegal immigrants have ANY right to free medical care, welfare, Social Security, Medicare, etc. as Liberals are proposing. I work in the Medical field and the system simply cannot handle the load.
Use the money spent on people with no right to be here on our Veterans, our homeless, our children, our drug addicted people, etc. It is both fair and logical.
As for racism,; when liberals stand up to black racists I will pay more attention to them. If Fox hired David Duke I Suspect there may be an uproar, yet CNN and every Democratic candidate kisses that thug Al Sharpton’s butt every time they see him.
Your kids (great looking kids by the way) would probably see racism in a 90% black school just like they do in their current school. I know in Hoover (a mostly white area) blacks come and go with little problems; the same cannot be said for whites going into black areas. If that sounds racist, I am sorry.
Best to you and hope this different point of view does not cause bad feelings. Like I said, I was very objective and moderate till 2016. The Liberal hatred changed me.
Darryl
Absolutely "white people" are not the only ones that can be racist. It happens everywhere and its rotten in all places it exists.
And of course no hard feelings whatsoever. My UK love and bond is MUCH greater than politics. Seriously.
~Puma~
D, I read a funny thing the other day:
“I’m proud to be an Asian” said the Asian man.
“I’m proud to be a black man” said the black man.
“I’m proud to be a white man” said the racist.
Darryl
People in general are conditioned to take a side and condemn the other. Whether in politics, music genres, sports, etc..
Rivals are evil.
And if it were not that way,, with everyone of the same mind, all media outlets would be out of business with none preferred over the other.
But because it appeals to the conditioning we have succumbed to...there is no desire whatsoever to admit we are being willingly deceived, herded, and/or manipulated.
I don't dislike or hate any who shares in the phenomenon..but I feel sorry for everyone who doesn't understand this.
Because even understanding it is not a solution in and of itself. But it the only starting place for healing. In this nation, neither political "side" will survive without heavy compromise from the other.
Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? Matthew 7:3
Thats not written for one side or the other....its written for all of us and applies to the nature of ALL mankind in general (especially Christians) and in all aspects of life.....including politics.
Without understanding that, there is no compromise. And without compromise there is no such thing as equality, human rights, nor even The United States of America and the precepts this nation was built upon.
That, we should all be able to agree upon...but I fear we won't. Which in itself re-enforces it as fact.
Perhaps an irreversible one at this point.
But if we dont, we will be the generation that betrayed this nation for our own self gratification.
The quote below by Senator McClain is as fitting for the time we live in as the Gettysburg Address was for its day and time. But if anyone believes our sources of news and opinion, on both sides, want such a society...they are 100% terribly mistaken.
“Before I leave I’d like to see our politics begin to return to the purposes and practices that distinguish our history from the history of other nations,
“I would like to see us recover our sense that we are more alike than different. We are citizens of a republic made of shared ideals forged in a new world to replace the tribal enmities that tormented the old one. Even in times of political turmoil such as these, we share that awesome heritage and the responsibility to embrace it.”
Last edited by kingcat; 09-18-2019 at 12:49 AM.
“Before I leave I’d like to see our politics begin to return to the purposes and practices that distinguish our history from the history of other nations,
“I would like to see us recover our sense that we are more alike than different. We are citizens of a republic made of shared ideals forged in a new world to replace the tribal enmities that tormented the old one. Even in times of political turmoil such as these, we share that awesome heritage and the responsibility to embrace it.”
-Patriot and Senator. John McCain
Why social discourse? CNN finally called out by somebody at CNN. This is a huge part of the reason for discourse
CNN contributor accuses Chris Cuomo of spreading 'fake news' about Trump in heated clash
https://www.foxnews.com/media/cnn-co...n-heated-clash
And what is a shame is that people fall subject to the tactic. Pundits intentionally read things into what Trump says that are not there on order to seed discourse. All people say things that are "gaffs", or could be taken in several ways but only one is constantly portrayed as the most possible offensive every single time. Obama's gaffs were mentioned them moved on. Same with GWB. So the 16 years of repecting the president and the office of the president was in large part due to how the man in the office is portrayed. Obama was every bit the racist Trump is. I suspect Bush used some of the same terms that Trump did...but all former Presidents are eventually given a pass and everybody moves on. Hell, Biden use the ol "locked em up in chains" and "you can't go into a 7-11 without seeing an Indian" yet he is portrayed as some civil right activiist. Imagine Trump saying something alongs those lines and it would be added to the proof he is a racist. I'm sure the media believes there is a white hood hanging in the Lincoln bedroom despite the Klan being an organization that is no longer relevent.
I have always respected the Office of the President, and continue to do so. Likewise I have always respected the electoral process and the results of that process, even when my guy lost. But mostly I ignore what the media, Hollywood elites and the opposing party opines. Their opinions are agenda driven, and thise are their's, not mine. And so while politics has become nasty, vile, uncivil and violent for a multitude of reasons, including the Presidents no holds bar approached, my request is that rather than tune it out, its simply look at that actual facts without the bias imput and ignore all the peripherals
Last edited by Doc; 09-18-2019 at 06:45 AM.
Aging is an extraordinary process where you become the person you always should have been.--David Bowie.
I agree King and Doc.
~Puma~
A follow up on this (and I am glad I waited to post this so I could be balanced in my attack):
The protesters attacking Trump supporters in Minnesota was appalling.
The video going viral that was played at a Trump Conference by his supporters is disgusting and dangerous.
Both are just more examples of exactly why I started this thread. I will say once again...the ONLY way this ever stops is if people on BOTH sides stop blaming the other side for all of this and playing a "who started what" chicken and egg game and simply take responsibility for themselves.
Its so sad that this is likely going to get worse before it gets better. And we aren't even in 2020 yet. It will not be long before this leads to some major egregious violent act (and I know there have been small ones) that will inevitably lead to some other violent act in retort. It needs to stop now.
~Puma~
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