Not good.

[badrose]

DHS Purchases 21.6 Million More Rounds of Ammunition

http://www.infowars.com/dhs-purchase...of-ammunition/

Such massive quantities of ammo purchases have stoked fears that the agency is preparing for some kind of domestic unrest. In 2011, Department of Homeland Security chief Janet Napolitano directed Immigration and Customs Enforcement to prepare for a mass influx of immigrants into the United States, calling for the plan to deal with the “shelter” and “processing” of large numbers of people.
The federal agency’s primary concern is now centered around thwarting “homegrown terrorism,” but information produced and used by the DHS to train its personnel routinely equates conservative political ideology with domestic extremism.
A study funded by the Department of Homeland Security that was leaked last year characterizes Americans who are “suspicious of centralized federal authority,” and “reverent of individual liberty” as “extreme right-wing” terrorists.

[jazyd]

Not good at all

[suncat05]

Either they're trying to corner the market on handgun ammo, or they're stocking up to use it..........any guesses who the 'usee's' may be?

[CitizenBBN]

They're definitely helping to restrict the ammo market. It's crazy when you just flat can't buy ammo. I've had a 500 rnd box of 22 for years and years and for the first time ever I'm thinking "thank goodness I have that box of 22". lol.

[dan_bgblue]

Yeah, guns no go boom without ammo in the tube.

[KeithKSR]

Yeah, guns no go boom without ammo in the tube.

May have to fend 'em off with the muzzleloader.

If they define half of Americans who did not vote for Obama to be right wing extremist most of us will be on the drone list. They certainly won't be able to count on that bunch of anti-gun pansies to come and take guns from the rest of us.

[suncat05]

I still fail to see the "need" of the federal government to have to have that much ammo in surplus. Unless there is a perceived "need" in the near future, and as to that thought I am just a bit more than apprehensive. Much more so, truthfully, than I have been since I've been watching the things this POTUS does.......

[KeithKSR]

I still fail to see the "need" of the federal government to have to have that much ammo in surplus. Unless there is a perceived "need" in the near future, and as to that thought I am just a bit more than apprehensive. Much more so, truthfully, than I have been since I've been watching the things this POTUS does.......

Causes me grave concerns also, the stocking of HP ammo is very disconcerting as HP ammo can not be used on enemy combatants and that only leaves one group for it to be used against. Also, have some concerns over the DHS having firearms at all.

[badrose]

Where are all the fingers going to come from?

[CitizenBBN]

Causes me grave concerns also, the stocking of HP ammo is very disconcerting as HP ammo can not be used on enemy combatants and that only leaves one group for it to be used against. Also, have some concerns over the DHS having firearms at all.

Agree with you and suncat. HP can only be used in non-military situations, i.e. on civilians, and more important for me it's not used for training. FMJ is cheaper and is the standard for training. HP is what you load for use, FMJ for the range. That's a LOT of ammo for groups that probably should not be armed in the first place.

I'm no conspiracy guy but when you add this to other orders this is a LOT of ammo and not ammo you'd order just to get your guys trained. 20 million rounds is "going to Iraq" quantity, not home defense quantity.

[KeithKSR]

For someone who promised to be the most transparent of presidents our present POTUS is extremely opaque and I don't trust his intentions with this maneuver one bit.

[suncat05]

Since this story became public I have spoken to two friends who work in two different federal agencies, I.C.E. & the U. S. Marshal's Service. Both are good, honest, stand-up guys, and this is what they told me : both said that their shooting/training used to almost exclusively be done with hardball ammo for qualifications, handgun & rifle. They both tell me that in the last couple of years that the frequency of training and the amounts of ammunitions used have both decreased significantly. They both said that not much hardball is used anymore and that the amount of rounds fired has dropped dramatically. They have now reached a point where the only rounds they shoot is their "old" duty ammo in a much shorter session, as in about 40 rounds expended and then they are issued new duty rounds. That's it, that's all the training they do with regards to firearms qualifications.
When my agency went to the range last November we did the same, exact thing. And it was the first time we had qualified like that, using no hardball rounds and shooting up our "old" hollowpoint rounds.
Still a lot of questions for me, in my mind. Is this a ploy by the government to keep this ammo off of store shelves, or are they buying it all up for some other purpose?
But the training symmetry has changed, so something is afoot, somewhere, for some reason.

[CitizenBBN]

suncat that's very interesting. I was pondering this and it did occur to me the agencies may choose to shoot the exact ammo they carry. There are very good reasons for it, esp. knowing the weapon is functioning well with that ammo.

However, if the total practice is going down, that's still a lot of rounds.

[KeithKSR]

suncat that's very interesting. I was pondering this and it did occur to me the agencies may choose to shoot the exact ammo they carry. There are very good reasons for it, esp. knowing the weapon is functioning well with that ammo.

However, if the total practice is going down, that's still a lot of rounds.

DHS has purchased an awful lot of ammo, a lot more than can be explained by training. Keep in mind that ammo should actually have had greater supplies available as the Iraq War wound down, which would mean civilian ammo suppliers should have more access to ammo than when the Iraq war was in full Swing. At the rate DHS is purchasing ammo it will continue to strain civilian supplies.

[dan_bgblue]

Lots of weapons in Mexico that need ammo, and each weapon runs thru a lot of rounds per day

[CitizenBBN]

Lots of weapons in Mexico that need ammo, and each weapon runs thru a lot of rounds per day

You'd think if we gave 'em the guns they'd meet us halfway and supply the ammo.

[dan_bgblue]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013...est=latestnews

[CitizenBBN]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013...est=latestnews

Unless there's a type-o, they're using 15 million rounds a year, and over 5 years that's 75 million rounds, but they say they would use up to 750 million. So they're going to increase range use across agencies by a factor of 10?

I don't really worry about it, I try to be very conservative about such things, but that math isn't quite right. It leaves them with an extra 675 million rounds over 5 years. That's a lot of new federal and local agents to have at the ranges.

I do question the contracting. You mean the price has any margin left in it that you don't get the best discount at the 500 million mark or the 1 billion mark? There's a point where you can only cut the price so much before you lose money. So my question is more about government procurement than the stockpiling based on that article.