Pfizer COVID vaccine greater than 90% effective

[KSRdallen]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/09/h...ne-pfizer.html

Great news.

[Darrell KSR]

Outstanding news.

[bigsky]

Buy pfizer

[kingcat]

This is as good as we could have hoped for. Now to implement it will require convincing half the population it is not a conspiracy tied to a hoax

[MickintheHam]

Nice little peak in the price of the stock since Friday. It’s been languishing a bit recently. Trump did say we would get a vaccine. Russians must have helped time the announcement.

[kingcat]

Just to be clear, the conspiracy/hoax thing is not political when it comes to a vaccine. Half the population does not trust a vaccine including many that I know. My wife and her family, a large family, will not receive any vaccine period. And of my family, also a large family an equal amount claim they will not either.

Most believe it is a government conspiracy not limited to any political party.)

[suncat05]

I will consider taking a vaccine, but not initially and until I can see any problems that may appear during the initial application to the general population.

[KSRBEvans]

Capture 11-9-20.jpg

https://twitter.com/cullenroche/stat...51495724535813

Far from official, but still good to see as a possibility.

[PedroDaGr8]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/09/h...ne-pfizer.html

Great news.

Much like the results of the Phase IIa trial, this is about as good of news as you can expect out of this stage. That being said, there are some caveats. The biggest, the data hasn't been through any sort of peer-review process and has only been announced via press release. Until this occurs, I am taking the numbers with a huge grain of salt (albeit very hopefully).

Capture 11-9-20.jpg

https://twitter.com/cullenroche/stat...51495724535813

Far from official, but still good to see as a possibility.

This is inline with both my own estimates (albeit from working in a related field) and from people I know much more knowledgeable about vaccines. I would expect Q2-Q3 timeframe, even if approved in Q1, the doses would be reserved for the most at risk populations (immunocompromised, elderly, etc.).


In related news, a new treatment with some promise. This treatment administers loads of the ACE2 protein to the patient. The viruses then latch on to this free-floating protein and can't unbind, in essence deactivating the virus.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41392-020-00374-6

[Darrell KSR]

In related news, a new treatment with some promise. This treatment administers loads of the ACE2 protein to the patient. The viruses then latch on to this free-floating protein and can't unbind, in essence deactivating the virus.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41392-020-00374-6

This is what I waiting for while everybody else's been discussing the vaccine. Of course, the vaccine is great news and I am excited about it. But with a daughter who is a Covid-19 ICU nurse, I have been especially interested in medications and treatment for those seriously infected. They have already gotten better, better, and better at treating patients in her unit, with both treatment and drugs. But what you have posted is super-exciting. Fingers crossed that it comes to pass as well. With a combination of both, maybe we can get back to normal.

[Catfan73]

Awesome news! And Pfizer isn’t one of the pharmaceuticals that got the government funding amazingly enough.

[KSRBEvans]

News today that Moderna's vaccine is also >90% effective in trials:

44B78F6C-EB18-49F7-8CEA-4CBB91740336.jpg

https://twitter.com/ScottGottliebMD/...12880006111237

[KSRdallen]

News today that Moderna's vaccine is also >90% effective in trials:

44B78F6C-EB18-49F7-8CEA-4CBB91740336.jpg

Here’s an article on it. Great news.

https://apnews.com/article/pandemics...39a5d234aba07b

[dan_bgblue]

Thanks very much to both Pedro and dallen. I appreciate you taking the time to share the info with us.

[KSRBEvans]

^Agreed, dallen.

Between the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines, 70,000,000 doses by the end of the year? Yes, please.

[Doc]

I will consider taking a vaccine, but not initially and until I can see any problems that may appear during the initial application to the general population.

I would take it tomorrow, and think nothing of it. I know pfizer.

[KSRdallen]

I would take it tomorrow, and think nothing of it. I know pfizer.

^This!

[KeithKSR]

I would take it tomorrow, and think nothing of it. I know pfizer.

Depends on what is in it. I have an egg white allergy and was advised against taking a flu vaccine 25 years ago.

[PedroDaGr8]

News today that Moderna's vaccine is also >90% effective in trials:

44B78F6C-EB18-49F7-8CEA-4CBB91740336.jpg

https://twitter.com/ScottGottliebMD/...12880006111237

I really want to see Moderna's data. They have a bad reputation for playing with the numbers via press release. If legit then it is great news but, unlike Pfizer, they do not have a track record that warrants faith without the full data.

Depends on what is in it. I have an egg white allergy and was advised against taking a flu vaccine 25 years ago.

These mRNA vaccines should be much easier for people to take since they don't typically require growth in other cells. Not to say there won't be stabilizers and what not which can cause an allergic reaction, just some of the big ones like eggs are unlikely to be used.

[blueboss]

The Moderna vaccine is now rated at 94.5% affective and doesn’t require being refrigerated to -90 f.

I’m in the trust Pfizer camp, but the challenges to keep it at temperature before being administered seems mind boggling.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[PedroDaGr8]

The Moderna vaccine is now rated at 94.5% affective and doesn’t require being refrigerated to -90 f.

I’m in the trust Pfizer camp, but the challenges to keep it at temperature before being administered seems mind boggling.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There are trade-offs for both.

For the Pfizer vaccine:
It is expected to cost around $20/dose. This is within the realm of international subsidy for poorer countries. The biggest downside with the vaccine is the storage temperature of -90°C (-70°C). This isn't as difficult as it seems for developed countries. These are dry ice temperatures and -80°C freezers are VERY common in hospitals, biological research labs, etc. As such, your large scale labs, hospitals, and Departments of Health are not going to have any issues with this requirement. I could foresee doctors offices and clinics getting the doses and having to store them on dry ice. To me, the biggest question is how do you cheaply and affordably ensure the reliability of the entire ultra-cold chain. That being said, poorer countries which do not have this infrastructure readily available are going to have issues being able to get this vaccine.

For the Moderna Vaccine:
It is expected to cost around $40/dose which is cost prohibitive for poorer countries even with subsidy. That being said, it has the benefit that it can be stored at 2-8°C for 1 month, which makes it easier to dispense in poorer countries from an infrastructure perspective (if the cost can come down).

[KSRdallen]

Pfizer update below. Trial ends at 95% effective. Clearance being sought within days.

https://apnews.com/article/coronavir...ee4df873ec1023

[dan_bgblue]

[PedroDaGr8]

Pfizer update below. Trial ends at 95% effective. Clearance being sought within days.

https://apnews.com/article/coronavir...ee4df873ec1023

This is absolutely HUGE news! My quick overview of the data (my comments in bold):

• Pfizer plans to file for FDA EUA within days. This filing will include clinical trial and manufacturing validation data - the latter is VERY surprising in a good way.

• Pfizer and BioNTech plan to submit the efficacy and safety data from the study for peer-review in a scientific journal once analysis of the data is completed. - This is a VERY important part of the process. The earlier they release the data, the quicker the data scientists and other experts can begin parsing the data.

• 43,000 participants enrolled with 41,000 receiving the second dose - this is a very solid number.
  
  • 42% from diverse ethnic backgrounds - this dramatically reduces the risk of undiscovered side effects in various ethnic backgrounds.
  • 41% between 56 to 85 years of age - considering this is the most at risk age ranges, good to see it well represented.

• The vaccine will be manufactured at four Pfizer plants: St. Louis, MO; Andover, MA; and Kalamazoo, MI in the U.S.; and Puurs in Belgium.
  
  • 50 million doses by the end of 2020 and 1.3 billion doses in 2021.
  • As expected, vaccine will be shipped on dry ice. - Exactly what I indicated a couple posts back.
  • Specially designed container allows for temporary storage for up to 15 days by simply refilling with dry ice.
  • Shipments will include GPS-enabled temperature loggers to ensure cold chain integrity.

• 170 total COVID Infections (10 severe) across all participants
  
  • 162 COVID infections (9 severe) in placebo group
  • 8 COVID infections (1 severe) in vaccinated group

• Immune Response, Efficacy, Side Effects
  
  • Immugenicity starts at 28 days (7 days after second dose)
  • Good immune response consistent across age, gender, race, and ethnicity
  • Vaccine is 95% overall and 94% effective in those over 65 years of age
  • Safety data review was performed by external and independent Phase III oversite committee
  • No serious side-effects reported
  • 2% of volunteers reported headaches and fatigue

• Potential Unknowns
  
  • How long immunity lasts.
  • If and/or how often periodic boosters will be necessary.
  • How a roll-out would be accomplished, who would get the vaccine, etc.
  • Exactly when the first shipments would start.

EDIT: Done

[kingcat]

A question about the mRNA vaccines. My sister is concerned with DNA alteration side effects. Is there any justification for such long term health issues that are at least rumored to be a concern?

[PedroDaGr8]

A question about the mRNA vaccines. My sister is concerned with DNA alteration side effects. Is there any justification for such long term health issues that are at least rumored to be a concern?

None at all.

I can understand the worry/confusion, as they are both nucleic acids. In spite of this, RNA and DNA serve entirely different purposes in the human body. Hopefully, my use of a commercial kitchen as an analogy, makes it easier to comprehend the difference. Please let me know if it helps since I have a feeling I will have to answer this for a lot with friends:

DNA is the official genetic record of a cell (the chef's recipe book). It contains a number of genes (recipes) and, to keep it safe, it remains securely locked in the nucleus (the chef's office).

mRNA is an active copy of a gene (think of it as a photocopy of a recipe) which is transferred by cellular machinery (chef's assistants) from the nucleus (the chef's office) to the cytoplasm (the kitchen) of the cell, where it can be used to make proteins (the dish in the recipe) by ribosomes (the cooks). Human cells lack the machinery (chef's assistants) to transfer mRNA (recipe photocopies) from the cytoplasm (kitchen) to the nucleus (chef's office). Additionally, even if the mRNA (the recipe photocopy) could somehow physically enter/re-enter the nucleus (the chef's office), the human body ALSO lacks the machinery (chef's assistants) to transcribe (physically insert) the RNA (the recipe photocopy) into the DNA (the chef's recipe book).

As such, despite them both being nucleotides, it is physically impossible for mRNA to alter DNA.

[Darrell KSR]

None at all.

I can understand the worry/confusion, as they are both nucleic acids. In spite of this, RNA and DNA serve entirely different purposes in the human body. Hopefully, my use of a commercial kitchen as an analogy, makes it easier to comprehend the difference. Please let me know if it helps since I have a feeling I will have to answer this for a lot with friends:

DNA is the official genetic record of a cell (the chef's recipe book). It contains a number of genes (recipes) and, to keep it safe, it remains securely locked in the nucleus (the chef's office).

mRNA is an active copy of a gene (think of it as a photocopy of a recipe) which is transferred by cellular machinery (chef's assistants) from the nucleus (the chef's office) to the cytoplasm (the kitchen) of the cell, where it can be used to make proteins (the dish in the recipe) by ribosomes (the cooks). Human cells lack the machinery (chef's assistants) to transfer mRNA (recipe photocopies) from the cytoplasm (kitchen) to the nucleus (chef's office). Additionally, even if the mRNA (the recipe photocopy) could somehow physically enter/re-enter the nucleus (the chef's office), the human body ALSO lacks the machinery (chef's assistants) to transcribe (physically insert) the RNA (the recipe photocopy) into the DNA (the chef's recipe book).

As such, despite them both being nucleotides, it is physically impossible for mRNA to alter DNA.

Anybody else hungry after reading this?

(j/k). Thanks for the great analogy, Pedro.

[KSRdallen]

None at all.

I can understand the worry/confusion, as they are both nucleic acids. In spite of this, RNA and DNA serve entirely different purposes in the human body. Hopefully, my use of a commercial kitchen as an analogy, makes it easier to comprehend the difference. Please let me know if it helps since I have a feeling I will have to answer this for a lot with friends:

DNA is the official genetic record of a cell (the chef's recipe book). It contains a number of genes (recipes) and, to keep it safe, it remains securely locked in the nucleus (the chef's office).

mRNA is an active copy of a gene (think of it as a photocopy of a recipe) which is transferred by cellular machinery (chef's assistants) from the nucleus (the chef's office) to the cytoplasm (the kitchen) of the cell, where it can be used to make proteins (the dish in the recipe) by ribosomes (the cooks). Human cells lack the machinery (chef's assistants) to transfer mRNA (recipe photocopies) from the cytoplasm (kitchen) to the nucleus (chef's office). Additionally, even if the mRNA (the recipe photocopy) could somehow physically enter/re-enter the nucleus (the chef's office), the human body ALSO lacks the machinery (chef's assistants) to transcribe (physically insert) the RNA (the recipe photocopy) into the DNA (the chef's recipe book).

As such, despite them both being nucleotides, it is physically impossible for mRNA to alter DNA.

This is brilliant! Nicely done, Pedro.

[kingcat]

Thank you very much

[dan_bgblue]

Pfizer applies for emergency use authorization yesterday