Coronavirus

[Catonahottinroof]

Half of the cases down here are within Palm Beach/Broward/Miami Dade Counties. Densely populated areas that like to be out and about.

Clearly there are large areas of the country unaffected, and other areas not doing a good job (ie NY and WA). Here in FL we have 17 deaths whichnis relatively small and no doubt the closing of group settings has helped stem expected explosion. But at this time it is time to move out of defcon 1

[ukpumacat]

I’m afraid Florida might be a couple of weeks behind everyone and will get hit really hard. Hope I’m wrong.

[KSRBEvans]

I’m afraid Florida might be a couple of weeks behind everyone and will get hit really hard. Hope I’m wrong.

We've been watching the news from The Villages because we might retire there someday. To say that many there are taking this lightly is an understatement. You move there to be active and social, but many don't seem to be taking the concept of social distancing seriously. Given the age of most residents, I'm hoping this doesn't blow through there.

[dan_bgblue]

35 mil for the Kennedy performing arts center in DC is in the house bill to fund Covid19 recovery. Reported on The Five

[KSRBEvans]

Sobering:

A team of researchers including a mathematician from the University of Louisville are poring over the numbers trying to estimate how far the coronavirus will spread in states like Kentucky....

As of Wednesday, 124 people have tested positive for COVID-19 in Kentucky with 32 of those cases coming from Jefferson County. Here are Han’s estimations for the next month:

Jefferson County
7 days: 68
15 days: 107
30 days: 232

Kentucky
7 days: 394
15 days: 635
30 days: 1,354

The researchers’ model assumed that the number of confirmed cases in Kentucky will peak after 150 days: on Thursday, August 20.

In that worst case scenario, without taking into consideration the impacts of social distancing, Han predicts by that time, there will be nearly 87,000 confirmed cases in Louisville and around 635,000 in Kentucky.

https://wfpl.org/how-this-u-of-l-res...s-in-kentucky/

[CitizenBBN]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/sen...democrats-vote

"In case you're watching," Graham said in reference to the president, his voice rising, "tell [Treasury Secretary] Steven Mnuchin to come back to the White House and end negotiations. I think I understand the give-and-take of life and politics, but I've been called by two good friends on the Democratic side in the last five or six hours wanting more money. End the negotiations."

It's going great. Nothing to see here. (and ending negotiations is right move at this point. Write the bill for up or down vote and dare Dems to stop it)



However, it's highly unlikely the bill could see a vote Tuesday night, given that lawmakers have not even finalized the text. A Thursday or Friday vote in the House of Representatives appeared possible. But, because many House lawmakers have not been in Washington, that process likely would involve a voice vote with a skeleton crew, essentially requiring unanimous consent -- meaning just one House member could kill the vote.

Remember, it'll all mean nothing in a week. Oh, wait, you mean it will be at least a week before we even have a bill on the President's desk thanks to these delays?

Would hate to interrupt the House to actually get to DC and do their job. I wonder who is responsible for allowing the House to not be there to vote on this NOW. Hmmm......

If the POTUS was at Mar Largo think we'd be getting those questions from the media?

[Padukacat]

I rarely have ventured over to this board, but figured I could learn a few things. Feel like I’ve read for about 10 hours a day on this topic. The political side of it sickens me, both ways. Politicians are crooks for the most part, how sad that is. Such poor judgement to mislead our nation to relax and think this thing was handled, it killed many. Also how are we so smart yet we’ve ignored the need for preparing for this type of pandemic which many knew was coming even before the first case. Hopefully we have learned our lesson. I fear our kind is not long for this world. I’ve been watching LOST again with the family, certainly makes you realize we all need to work out our past and move beyond to prepare for what lies ahead. Thanks to all who posted their views and info, I love soaking it up.

[CitizenBBN]

Don't worry paduka, we'll be OK. It won't be pretty, but for better or worse humans have survived far greater threats than this one.

[ukpumacat]

And as expected. A deal reached tonight. Shocker.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/25/p...rus/index.html

[CitizenBBN]

Not shocked. Don't recall anyone suggesting there would be no deal. Another fallacy, the strawman. Now I can't wait to hear what great "flaws" were fixed with this delay.

Now we PRAY the House doesn't have a single loose member since Pelosi saw fit for it to not be in session for a vote, and I'm told 96 hours for SBA to implement the bill once Trump signs it. One wingnut from Michigan already carping about it being "corporate welfare". Pelosi better tie a knot in his ass or they'll own that failure too.

So from the time the Senate started say about 3 weeks. That's a lot of payroll people have to cover on the promise they'll get help.

This was a despicable move, period. The deal got done b/c it was a political loser for Democrats and Trump's approval is record high. So they let it go and then will no doubt declare victory, but the key will be to see if there is any substantive change in the bill. I'm betting not really. A bit more oversight, could have been worked out on Sunday or Monday by lunch.

You've worried for weeks that people don't take this seriously enough then defend actions that clearly treat this as politics as usual and not dire. The House bill was a complete joke. Why even do that?

They played politics and lost, b/c most people would never think this is an OK time to play politics. The fact they lost quickly doesn't reassure me about the future of this crisis or this government.

[goodycat]

Unfortunately, Democrats are conditioned to politically pushing the envelope in times of crisis because they almost universally receive cover from most media outlets (like any government shutdowns, impeachment, etc.). Therefore, I firmly believe they created that bill in the House with the expectation that they would receive no criticism and that the White House would receive intense pressure to agree to these ridiculous requests because the media would portray the president as being callous and reckless for not agreeing to the Democrats’ demands. Luckily, the contents of the House bill became public and some in the media thankfully criticized the Democrats which led to them caving.

[kingcat]

Anyone that believes either side superior morally to the other when the lives of their loved ones are at stake needs to re-evaluate. They are willfully blind.

It’s so silly it needs no argument. But political games are what each side plays and the only way they know to function. That includes all your favorites in the WH and Congress. Bank on that

[ukpumacat]

Anyone that believes either side superior morally to the other when the lives of their loved ones are at stake needs to re-evaluate. They are willfully blind.

It’s so silly it needs no argument. But political games are what each side plays and the only way they know to function. That includes all your favorites in the WH and Congress. Bank on that

Yup.

I’m glad this deal got done. In a Congress as divided and partisan as ours has been, I’m glad they came to an agreement.

[ukpumacat]

Here is an update to this chart...now including several other states.

The biggest thing to notice...stay at home orders work. California is the most populous state with a few very dense areas. But the Governor was the first to issue a statewide Stay at Home order (NY quickly followed). But, California did it with much less cases.
One week ago, we were at almost the same spot as New York.

To be fair to New York, I think this virus has been there for months (likely in California also). And NYC is far more dense and uses far more public transportation than any city in California (or elsewhere). So the spread is inevitably going to be faster.
And all of this is knock on wood...we may see a huge spike in coming days in California and one person dying is too many for that family.
But, overall, stay at home orders do work. Hope other states see some success with it as well.

https://twitter.com/Nathan510edge/st...628929/photo/1

[goodycat]

Anyone that believes either side superior morally to the other when the lives of their loved ones are at stake needs to re-evaluate. They are willfully blind.

It’s so silly it needs no argument. But political games are what each side plays and the only way they know to function. That includes all your favorites in the WH and Congress. Bank on that

I said nothing about moral superiority, I was simply commenting on my opinion as to why Democrats would feel comfortable trying to include unnecessary ideological items in such an important piece of legislation.

Bringing up moral superiority is merely a straw man argument.

[CitizenBBN]

Anyone that believes either side superior morally to the other when the lives of their loved ones are at stake needs to re-evaluate. They are willfully blind.

It’s so silly it needs no argument. But political games are what each side plays and the only way they know to function. That includes all your favorites in the WH and Congress. Bank on that

Strawman. No one suggested moral superiority anywhere in any thread.

When the GOP plays games I call it out. In this case they really didn't play games. There wasn't a single extraneous funding provision in the bill from the Senate on Sunday of which I'm aware (if there was it must have been minor as it was unreported). Second, they passed the Phase II House bill without debate or complaint despite it having several such provisions. They let it go for the good of expediency and getting things done.

I'm sorry if sometimes the GOP does in fact do the right thing and the Democrats do not, but this is one of those cases.

Likewise, the impeachment of Trump was truly wrong, and is on the Democrats, just as the impeachment of Clinton was 100% on the GOP and they need to own it. The GOP has played these games in the past, but with a couple of differences:

1) B/c they lack broad media support the GOP can't get away with it as much. If this were a GOP move with a Democratic POTUS and Senate the entire mainstream media would have roasted them for this maneuver. With it being the Democrats doing it they were largely silent. Sure Fox is on the GOP side, but the networks, almost all newspapers, CNN and MSNBC are all on the other side. That's a very large voice.

2) This is an unprecedented crisis, and "politics as usual" is totally unacceptable in this situation. Doing this in a normal budget debate is a given. Doing this even with a minor crisis I would agree with puma that it's just how things work. But this is truly exceptional.

You have to have some f-ing brass to be sitting in Congress looking at the threat of a global pandemic and depression and start worrying about funding for the National Endowment for the Arts and emissions limits on airlines. Whether it delays a bill one minute or days, that's just an insult to anyone with any intelligence and is a complete slap in the face to the supposedly critical message that leaders send that this is a serious if not dire situation and that people need to take it extremely seriously.

How serious do you expect people to take it if it's all just business as usual and pork projects and logrolling in Washington? What message does that send?

Feel free to point out the equivalent thing the GOP has done that is so divisive and partisan in this current crisis and I'll wail about them too, but so far they've actually been far better in this situation. To be equivalent they would have needed to put in border wall funding or increased deportations or big defense spending pork, etc. That would make them equal in this, but that didn't happen.

That's just how it goes. I call pox on both their houses on principle b/c I dislike government, politicians and the concentration of power among elites, but in this specific crisis the GOP has done the right thing and the Democrats have tried to make political hay from it.

I won't throw the GOP leadership under the bus when they've done the right things. If they change that tomorrow I'll call it out.

[KeithKSR]

Here is an update to this chart...now including several other states.

The biggest thing to notice...stay at home orders work. California is the most populous state with a few very dense areas. But the Governor was the first to issue a statewide Stay at Home order (NY quickly followed). But, California did it with much less cases.
One week ago, we were at almost the same spot as New York.

To be fair to New York, I think this virus has been there for months (likely in California also). Any NYC is far more dense and uses far more public transportation than any city in California (or elsewhere). So the spread is inevitably going to be faster.
And all of this is knock on wood...we may see a huge spike in coming days in California and one person dying is too many for that family.
But, overall, stay at home orders do work. Hope other states see some success with it as well.

https://twitter.com/Nathan510edge/st...628929/photo/1

During morning and evening rushes in NYC the people are jammed in public transportation like sardines. One person could expose thousands in a very short time.

[kingcat]

"The biggest sticking point between Democrats and Republicans throughout the negotiations was $500 billion worth of emergency loans both for large businesses and municipalities grappling with the coronavirus outbreak. For instance, $50 billion of that money was allotted to passenger airlines, according to the Washington Post.
Rather than trying to negotiate that figure down, Democrats instead negotiated to have strings attached to it. Instead of giving the Trump administration broad discretion to make the loans, Schumer and Pelosi said there will likely be a new inspector general in the Treasury Department specifically to oversee these funds, as well as a congressional oversight panel to examine how the money is being used"

"Direct payments to adults below a certain income threshold: The legislation would include a one-time $1,200 check that would be sent to most adults making $75,000 or less annually, according to past tax returns. A $500 payment would also be sent to cover every child in qualifying households. The final policy marks a significant change from the direct payments initially proposed by Republicans, which would have given less to many individuals who do not have taxable income. It now includes the majority of adults who are under the $75,000 threshold and phases the payment out as people’s incomes increase"

"Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer and White House Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin met six times on Monday alone, working until the early hours of the morning on Tuesday to hammer out a deal. In a statement, Schumer said he was pleased with the result.
“Rather than accept such a fundamentally flawed, partisan bill, Senate Democrats have been working hard on a bipartisan bill with Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin and President Trump,” Schumer said. “I am pleased to report that our hard work has paid off.”
The final product is so large in part because it contains both Republican and Democratic proposals: $500 billion in federal funding for big businesses and municipalities hit hard by the coronavirus outbreak, as well as a direct one-time cash payment to Americans and four months of expanded unemployment insurance"

[kingcat]

Strawman. No one suggested moral superiority anywhere in any thread.

Red Herring!..

I dont want argument (it is not the time for it) but in fact, it's (moral superiority) implied in many posts here. It is understandable given that political spin is a weapon that's been perfected over the years.

I did not call anyone out for it as it works both ways..I just told the plain, unrehearsed truth.

A strawman argument falsely assumes there are agreed upon facts in a matter. Fact is, many of the examples did not include the sensible concessions both sides achieved in attaining an agreed upon bill.
Only those that could paint Dems in a bad light.

I love ya' Chuck. You're a good Republican.

..and thats not coming from a Democrat as I am now officially claiming to be independent and view things unencumbered by the current political climate..

[Catonahottinroof]

I love ya' Chuck. You're a good Republican

And therein lies the falsehood (strawman) in your argument. Can you not really distinguish a Libertarian from a Republican? Or do you just deem it republican because his point of view disagrees with yours?

Believe it or not, libertarians can see evil in both parties. Yes, it’s there on the right, just not as glaring as it is on the left currently.

[GhettoBird]

"The biggest sticking point between Democrats and Republicans throughout the negotiations was $500 billion worth of emergency loans both for large businesses and municipalities grappling with the coronavirus outbreak. For instance, $50 billion of that money was allotted to passenger airlines, according to the Washington Post.
Rather than trying to negotiate that figure down, Democrats instead negotiated to have strings attached to it. Instead of giving the Trump administration broad discretion to make the loans, Schumer and Pelosi said there will likely be a new inspector general in the Treasury Department specifically to oversee these funds, as well as a congressional oversight panel to examine how the money is being used"

"Direct payments to adults below a certain income threshold: The legislation would include a one-time $1,200 check that would be sent to most adults making $75,000 or less annually, according to past tax returns. A $500 payment would also be sent to cover every child in qualifying households. The final policy marks a significant change from the direct payments initially proposed by Republicans, which would have given less to many individuals who do not have taxable income. It now includes the majority of adults who are under the $75,000 threshold and phases the payment out as people’s incomes increase"

"Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer and White House Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin met six times on Monday alone, working until the early hours of the morning on Tuesday to hammer out a deal. In a statement, Schumer said he was pleased with the result.
“Rather than accept such a fundamentally flawed, partisan bill, Senate Democrats have been working hard on a bipartisan bill with Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin and President Trump,” Schumer said. “I am pleased to report that our hard work has paid off.”
The final product is so large in part because it contains both Republican and Democratic proposals: $500 billion in federal funding for big businesses and municipalities hit hard by the coronavirus outbreak, as well as a direct one-time cash payment to Americans and four months of expanded unemployment insurance"

I think the original GOP plan until Pelosi came back to town had more money going directly into Americans pockets. I thought the threshold was those single filers under $99,000 would receive money, and joint filers under $150,000 would receive money. Also, I thought the original amount proposed was higher per child?

[CitizenBBN]

Red Herring!..

I dont want argument (it is not the time for it) but in fact, it's (moral superiority) implied in many posts here. It is understandable given that political spin is a weapon that's been perfected over the years.

I did not call anyone out for it as it works both ways..I just told the plain, unrehearsed truth.

A strawman argument falsely assumes there are agreed upon facts in a matter. Fact is, many of the examples did not include the sensible concessions both sides achieved in attaining an agreed upon bill.
Only those that could paint Dems in a bad light.

I love ya' Chuck. You're a good Republican.

..and thats not coming from a Democrat as I am now officially claiming to be independent and view things unencumbered by the current political climate..

I'm not a Republican other than in registration so I can vote. I'm a Libertarian, but the Libertarian party is overrun with too many wingnuts to be of use.

I end up on the GOP side simply b/c on average they will be closer to the Libertarian position.

I used to defend the GOP on fiscal/foreign policy issues (i tend to be more real politik on foreign affairs than most Libertarians), and the Democrats on most social issues.

The Democrats have in the last 5 or so years gone utterly off the page on a national level so now even on social issues the Left has become as totalitarian or even moreso than the New Right was in the 80s with Falwell et al. I railed against them then, but they are now an afterthought in the GOP power structure compared to the New Left totalitarianism of thought we see.

I defend Trump a lot on here simply b/c the guy gets a lot of bad rap due to his personality. it's patently absurd to think he's plotting to overthrow the government or declare himself King. he's an asshat, I don't like him personally, most of what he says has the intellectual sophistication of bathroom humor, but he's not a "dictator" or "subverting democracy" etc. and for the most part his policies have been reasonable and mostly in the direction I want as a Libertarian.

As a Libertarian what I despise is the concentration of power, the control of the elites, the selling out of America by global corporations that are as much Chinese now as they are American, the repression of free markets (by government and those corporations), putting social justice above liberty, etc.

So I don't like the GOP leadership much more than I do the Democrats. It's just that they happen to implement policies closer to the vision of this country, if only by a little bit at times.

Despite inferences and conclusions here, I'm far more neutral on this Democrat/Republican thing than you would ever imagine. If I were in charge we'd wipe out so much government it wouldn't much matter who was in charge, they wouldn't have the power to do anything.

And yes, it is a strawman fallacy. Not sure what you mean by having to have agreed upon facts, but that has nothing to do with the definition of the strawman fallacy. The strawman fallacy is when a person claims the other side has taken a position and then attacks that position, when that position was never in fact taken.

No one here claimed moral superiority. Next week it may be the GOP that does this political nonsense, and I said all along there is some of it everything. But this was extremely excessive. Putting in funding for the NEA and the Kennedy Center in this bill? Oh please.

Hell, even the guy who WROTE the Green New Deal has called the airline emissions thing "stupid". he's surely as left as you can get and even he said it was wrong to address it in this legislation as this was about saving jobs and the economy, and was meaningless in doing anything to abate climate change. When that guy calls it out as a baseless political move you know you've done it.

[CitizenBBN]

And therein lies the falsehood (strawman) in your argument. Can you not really distinguish a Libertarian from a Republican? Or do you just deem it republican because his point of view disagrees with yours?

Believe it or not, libertarians can see evil in both parties. Yes, it’s there on the right, just not as glaring as it is on the left currently.

People here would die to have known me in the 1980s when the New Right was riding high.

I rail against the restriction of our rights, and against sacrificing individual liberty for some current iteration of "social justice", which is just a nice way of saying equality of outcomes, which is of course the fundamental guiding principle of socialism and communism.

When Bush II and the then GOP were spending like drunk sailors being Democrat Lite I railed against that on here too. When the GOP impeached Clinton I thought it was idiotic and a waste, even if technically yes there was a valid case as he committed a felony. It just wasn't enough of a felony to distract the nation and undermine the Office to the global community.

I've called Trump every name in the book on here for 3 years, but I won't accuse him of things that are simply not supported by the facts either.

Is he the smartest POTUS ever? Uh, no. But is he less fit than Carter or Bush II? Absolutely not. He's not 1/100the the pig LBJ was ether personally or in his utter disregard for American lives. As Presidents go he's been solid but not exceptional.

That's just my objective view, I feel no need to defend him as part of "my side" or my tribe b/c I'm not part of his tribe. He's useful to me in that his judicial appointments are going to be by and large less activist and Leftist. Everything else is gravy, as I said before the election.

but this current move by Pelosi and the Dem leadership is beyond the poltical pale, and I assure you if it were the GOP doing it I'd be just as mad. If there as border wall funding in this thing or deportation changes or spending some new tank the military doesn't even want then I'd be just as furious.

But they simply didn't to that this time. They didn't.

IF the Democrats stuck to only negotiating the key points Kingcat listed then fine, but they had LAST WEEK for Schumer and Pelosi to weigh in while this thing was in 5 committees with both GOP and Dems.

They DID all that last week, then after the deal was thought to be done they blew it up. They timed that for the leverage of it, to get more concessions. I'm no fool, I know how it works, they thought doing it this way would put pressure on Trump and the GOP as it usually does.

But it didn't this time. Come to find out the media was tepid at best to the move and Trump's numbers are way up right now as Americans tend to rally around the flag and the sitting POTUS in times of crisis.

They miscalculated and it blew up in their face. They got a few minor changes in the bill so they can come out last night declaring victory like they somehow put workers in the bill, when they were there from the start.

Like the man said, don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining. The Dems had to find a way to get out of this mess of their own making. that House bill made them look TERRIBLE to any casual observer other than their pet interest groups who pushed for those things and they didn't realize it until they pulled the trigger Sunday night.

[Catonahottinroof]

If you want to hear a libertarian rail against the president, I’ll oblige that too. He’s absolutely bat$hit crazy to suggest the economy will re-open by April 13th.
We are In the new normal until an existing drug or a vaccine becomes available. Vaccine is 12-18 months out. A lot of suggestion of existing drugs, or a cocktail of those drugs is going on currently. Nothing but trial and error....and time and I don’t see how it clears up in the next 3 weeks....

[CitizenBBN]

It sure won't be 3 weeks. I know a lot of Trump supporters given I live in kentucky, and none of them think that's even close to being reality. 3 or 4 times that may not be close, and everyone knows it.

I get his motives, but like his other comments that it was licked, etc. he's just so naturally exaggerating in everything and this is one place where it's a real detriment. It's ignored when he describes the Ukraine call as "perfect" or his Administration as "the best ever" b/c it means nothing. But this is not a place for such frivolous rhetoric.

The good news is that policy wise nothing will come of it. With Trump I try to ignore his words and just focus on what he does. His actions are really pretty solid, if he'd just shut up.

[Doc]

I find it funny that many on the left love Cuomo's pressers. Today he spoke about not being scared and how we will persevere. Then he spoke about the unique nature of New Yorkers and why they are so exceptional. Then he discussed the shortages of ventilators and mentioned that none were available because some were being hoarded. Next when asked about the ventilators NY just recieved and where they, he mentioned they are being stored in various locations until a hospital calls and requests one. I came away confused because he mentioned numerous times about supplies being hoarded and that there were no stockpiles of ventilators then talked about all the reserve ventilators NY has in reserve (aka stockpiled and hoarded)

But the topper was when he suggested he was glad that NY was where the biggest hot spot was because of the exceptionaism of NYers. Trump utters glad and it is suddenly reported he is glad there is an outbreak! Much like his "hoax" comment, it is report way differnet than it is said.

I don't take much of Trumps comments as anything more than wishful thinking/hoping, or best case scenario. Being doom and gloom is not what a leader does. Be optimistic and inspiring. Imagine Churchhill saying the Germans are going to be bombing the hell out of us for a year. Hunker down and maybe we get thru it! Should he exaggerate? Nope. And is he the greatest (fill in the blank)? Nope. There are many people smarter then him too. But policy-wise he is listening to those in the know (and taking some credit for it) and the decisions made seem to be correct thus far. His racist policy of closing the boarders was smart and likely bought significant time. His leaving much to the states over federalization was also very wise. He has gone all in to help states even to the point where Cuomo has little to complain about was also great. Personally I'm all in on his calling out China for the CHINA FLU! and holding them accountable. Apparently, based on his approval of his handling, most American's agree (60% was the last number I heard which is shocking considering 50% hate everything he does regardless). Likely more an illustration on the lack of leadership shown by the left than anything

[kingcat]

Republicans now holding things up.

Sen. Graham said they learned the details of the deal during a 92-minute conference call Senate Republicans had on Wednesday morning.
They are asking for a vote on an amendment that would cap unemployment benefits at 100 percent of a person's salary.
Their demand sparked immediate bipartisan pushback.

Sen. Chris Murphy (D-Conn.) tweeted: "Let's not over-complicate this. Several Republican Senators are holding up the bipartisan Coronavirus emergency bill because they think the bill is too good for laid off Americans."

A Senate GOP aide pushed back against the four senators, underscoring the divisions within the caucus, saying that "nothing in this bill incentivizes businesses to lay off employees, in fact it's just the opposite."
"Each state has a different UI program, so the drafters opted for a temporary across-the-board UI boost of $600, which can deliver needed aid in a timely manner rather than burning time to create a different administrative regime for each state. ...

It's also important to remember that nobody who voluntarily leaves an available job is eligible for UI," the aide added.

[kingcat]

Bare with me as its pretty confusing but, the key word is temporary and the advantage is its guaranteed and quick, and everyone can draw at least 100 percent of their wage.
That, while some will draw more than their wage.
And all because each state's system is different and it would take some time to redo each system to a universal federally mandated one.

Instead, this serves as a temporary way to get wages to every American worker quickly.

is that correct?

Im not arguing right or wrong by the way nor whats best for the economy. As most here have stated, getting the help to people quickly is of utmost importance. That's the reason implied in the article anyway.

[CitizenBBN]

Bare with me as its pretty confusing but, the key word is temporary and the advantage is its guaranteed and quick, and everyone can draw at least 100 percent of their wage.
That, while some will draw more than their wage.
And all because each state's system is different and it would take some time to redo each system to a universal federally mandated one.

Instead, this serves as a temporary way to get wages to every American worker quickly.

is that correct?

Kentucky UE gives you roughly 50-60% of what you earn. that's really rough, but a good thumbnail.

So say you make $40,000K a year. That's about $1,500 bi-weekly or $750/wk. UE in Kentucky would give you about $475 per week at that rate (very rough).

But now you get $600 per week on top of that, no questions asked. So if I lay off a $40K per year worker they go UP from $750/wk to $1,075 per week, making $325 MORE per week. that's BIG. You go from roughly $18.75 per hour to $26.90 per hour.

From my numbers you'd have to make north of $55K a year before this isn't a net win to be laid off.


The unintended consequences of that is what Graham fears, and I fear he's right. That's a HUGE incentive to not work versus work.

My staff will be coming to me asking us to shut down. Who wouldn't? you don't work and you make MORE?

that GOP staff guy is an idiot. Sure they can't just quit and do it, but they sure can be pissed off at me to high Heaven for not laying them off and having them come in and work.

Wouldn't you prefer to be off work for 2 months and then come back? Would you be good with a boss not working with you on that deal?

Hell, they'll be offering to game the system. "Hey boss, I'll come in and work my hours, you just lay me off and let me get this raise for 2 months and we'll love ya forever."

What a damned mess.

I'm THRILLED at the idea of supplementing UE with federal money. Cutting millions to 50-60% of their income is a very bad idea right now. I'm good up to 100% due to the situation. I hated the idea of my staff having to take so much less if faced with that situation.

But for a $40K a year person to get about a 40% RAISE for 2 months if they dont' work?

Boy howdy, that's a bad idea. Only in Washington can an entire Senate full of members and staff sit around for a week and come up with that scheme.

And then apparently some of the key members don't even know about it. Now THAT is a screw up worthy of criticism. This should have been clear and addressed last week in committee. For them to just now figure it out is absolutely a failure.

But it's a failure, not a political ploy.

[kingcat]

I guess the question is, what is meant by temporary. If it is for two or three months I doubt it would affect the job force.
It would seem the wise thing to do is for each state to upgrade their existing systems as quick as possible. And then for Congress to revisit the provision.

The exact quote from the GOP aide..

"Each state has a different UI program, so the drafters opted for a temporary across-the-board UI boost of $600, which can deliver needed aid in a timely manner rather than burning time to create a different administrative regime for each state. ... It's also important to remember that nobody who voluntarily leaves an available job is eligible for UI,"


https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...cid=spartandhp