Talk to me about Liberty Civil Defense Ammunition

[Darrell KSR]

.45 ACP load.

I carry 220 grain, .45 ACP +P Hornady Critical Defense as my personal self-defense load. Like it. Love it. I do not have the recoil issues that some might suggest; it stays on target, almost a nice rocking motion as opposed to a flip. No reason to change.

Friend sent me some info on the Liberty Civil Defense Ammunition, and suggested it might be a better way to go.

.45 ACP +P, 78 grain--yes, 78 grain. You may be very knowledgeable about that; I was shocked.

It is rated at 1900 fps (with some tests indicating higher), and 625 ft-pounds muzzle energy.
Hornady is 975 fps, and 464 ft-pounds muzzle energy, as you would expect a heavier bullet to go slower.

What am I missing? Brief research seems to indicate that the Liberty 78 grain bullet penetrates fine and creates a 5-inch wound cavity. But doesn't overpenetrate. Probably won't be shooting through windows with that load.

Is that the only real drawback? With positives being less chance of going through your inside home wall, and having less recoil?

Somebody explain to me why I shouldn't move to the Liberty Civil Defense Ammo load for in-home defense, at least. (By the way, if I wanted to get this for my 9mm--which I might do, and continue to carry what I carry with my .45--the 9mm Liberty load is 50 grain.)

[dan_bgblue]

I am not the right guy to respond to our question, but did have a comment or two. The bullet weight and the muzzle velocity sounds like something a varmint hunter would use to dispatch ground hogs, foxes, and other small targets. They would hesitate to take that load deer hunting. I know that deer can be brought down with a .22 cal long rifle cartridge, but it takes a perfect shot to do that.

[Darrell KSR]

I am very interested in your thoughts, Dan, as well as anyone else's.

As you know, I'm not a hunter, and not really what I call a "gun person," although I own a few. (I know others that would disagree with my self-definition, and that's fine, too).

I am intrigued with this ammo. The reviews I have seen continue to surprise me.

[Darrell KSR]

Not thrilled with this video.

https://youtu.be/T_hZMZM1l04

[dan_bgblue]

I took a quick look this morning...............

The 78 Grain Lead-Free Fragmenting Hollow Point bullet travels at 1900 feet per second, resulting in 12 inches of ballistic gel penetration and a permanent wound cavity greater than 5 inches in diameter.


The hollow point bullet is one of the main keys to it's lethal capabilities

[dan_bgblue]

I think the video was fairly done

[Darrell KSR]

I do, too. I'm not convinced it's a better choice than a higher grain bullet, at least in the 9mm load.

The marketing for it sounds great, and it looks great on paper, especially in the .45 ACP. On paper.

[dan_bgblue]

I believe they would be great loads for critters under 35 lbs unless they are an armadillo.

[CitizenBBN]

I"m highly dubious.

The whole point of the 45 is to deliver a lot of weight relatively lower velocity to create knock down force and damage without over penetration. To me this would be like shooting a high velocity 380 out of a 45. Not sure I get the point.

You don't want to over penetrate and go through the wall and into your neighbor's house, but you need enough to get penetration in the target regardless of clothing. To me this seems like a step back, whereas the 45 is shown to be a very good balance of power and avoiding over penetration.

[suncat05]

If I were you, I'd stick with the Hornady. Very high quality ammunition manufactured under very strict standards. And as CBBN stated, the reason for the heavier weight bullet in .45 ACP is for that initial stopping power. Although I am very fond of the .40 S&W round, if I had another choice for a duty weapon and round I would go with the .45 ACP all day long, every day. Over 100 years of US military use cannot be wrong.
Now, for the 9mm cartridge, I would also recommend anything Hornady too. Any of the Critical Defense or Critical Duty rounds will work just fine. Myself, I carry Hornady Critical Defense in .38 special loads in my S&W "J" frame off-duty carry handgun. And in a recent experiment with my daughter's participation, we shot several differing brands and loads of 9mm ammo for her Ruger LC9. She really, really liked the Hornady Critical Defense "LITE" rounds, 100 grain hollowpoints. Not too 'snappy' like some rounds can be out of that short of a barrel, and the ballistics reports are very good.
Stick with the Hornady rounds Darrell. You cannot go wrong there. JMHO.

[Darrell KSR]

Thanks for the input, I appreciate it. Good advice given by all.