Military Coup in Turkey?

[CitizenBBN]

Remember Obama and Kerry came out in support of this man staying in power and laughingly called him "democratically elected". How's that working out?

The coup was so poorly done and so narrow I imagine it was staged so Erdogan could seize power, and now this "democratically elected" leader of a "democracy" is rounding up every dissenting educator and bureaucrat in the country by force and without legal authority and establishing a dictatorship. His visions of a neo-Ottoman empire is all the closer.

Not that Obama had much he could do, it just sounds awfully foolish and it was foolish b/c defending him as democratically elected is about like doing that for Hilter after the Reichstag fire or, more analogous, Kristallnacht. If anything we should have fomented a coup to eventually get back to a democracy, b/c that sucker's dead now in Turkey.

[Doc]

Remember Obama and Kerry came out in support of this man staying in power and laughingly called him "democratically elected". How's that working out?

The coup was so poorly done and so narrow I imagine it was staged so Erdogan could seize power, and now this "democratically elected" leader of a "democracy" is rounding up every dissenting educator and bureaucrat in the country by force and without legal authority and establishing a dictatorship. His visions of a neo-Ottoman empire is all the closer.

Not that Obama had much he could do, it just sounds awfully foolish and it was foolish b/c defending him as democratically elected is about like doing that for Hilter after the Reichstag fire or, more analogous, Kristallnacht. If anything we should have fomented a coup to eventually get back to a democracy, b/c that sucker's dead now in Turkey.

Which is why the US had to publicly back the current government.

But for clarity, I'm not saying they/we should. IMO he is one of those radicals however unseating him could result in worse (see Libya, Syria)

[Catonahottinroof]

This is the kind of thing that brings about an assassination attempt....

[CitizenBBN]

Which is why the US had to publicly back the current government.

But for clarity, I'm not saying they/we should. IMO he is one of those radicals however unseating him could result in worse (see Libya, Syria)

They really weren't forced to make any statement either way at that point. They could have gone with "closely monitoring the situation" and left it at that.

Obama constantly shows his pink underbelly to every dictator and bully in the world, thinking that if he jsut cozies up to them enough they'll change and be nice. It hasn't worked once yet, and in fact I doubt it's worked once in human history from playgrounds to foreign diplomacy.

Have they now condemned this vast overreaction that is undermining that democracy? Of course not, that would be standing up to the guy. They seem like they won't hand over Gulen, which is good, but here's the crux of it:

when the US plays soft with these guys, they think they can get away with even more and they go even further. When Bush I told Saddam we had no defense agreement with Kuwait he read that as the green light to invade. When Obama gives support to Erdogan even after he's spend the past few years undermining his own democracy, he feels he's been greenlighted to go even farther.

Same with Russia, same with North Korea, China in the South China Sea, pretty much everywhere for 8 years running.

I'm not saying Obama is responsible, but I am saying this repeated failure to contain these expansionist dictators is in part due to his unwillingness to send the strong message that them acting out will not be tolerated and will draw a proper response.

[Doc]

They really weren't forced to make any statement either way at that point. They could have gone with "closely monitoring the situation" and left it at that.

Obama constantly shows his pink underbelly to every dictator and bully in the world, thinking that if he jsut cozies up to them enough they'll change and be nice. It hasn't worked once yet, and in fact I doubt it's worked once in human history from playgrounds to foreign diplomacy.

Have they now condemned this vast overreaction that is undermining that democracy? Of course not, that would be standing up to the guy. They seem like they won't hand over Gulen, which is good, but here's the crux of it:

when the US plays soft with these guys, they think they can get away with even more and they go even further. When Bush I told Saddam we had no defense agreement with Kuwait he read that as the green light to invade. When Obama gives support to Erdogan even after he's spend the past few years undermining his own democracy, he feels he's been greenlighted to go even farther.

Same with Russia, same with North Korea, China in the South China Sea, pretty much everywhere for 8 years running.

I'm not saying Obama is responsible, but I am saying this repeated failure to contain these expansionist dictators is in part due to his unwillingness to send the strong message that them acting out will not be tolerated and will draw a proper response.

It worked for Poland with Germany during WWII (LOL)

[PedroDaGr8]

Turkey now has suspended the European Convention on Human Rights. They are looking to re-enact the death penalty, this is basically a false flag operation in a nutshell. This has been WELL planned out from the get go and Obama was played like a fiddle.

[CitizenBBN]

Brief article summarizing my point, that Obama's lack of response only encourages further action, and that the US has long long known Erdogan has been systematically undoing democracy, not defending it.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016...n-expands.html

Hell, Gullen is in the US b/c secular democracy is being ravaged in Turkey, it's not like we don't know what he's doing, and we've done nothing but voice support for it.

Anyone who called out Bush I for his tepid handle on Saddam needs to speak up now, b/c it's the same thing. The US MUST push back against these kinds of expansions and tyrants and the general destruction of a democracy, and yet we do nothing, not even Obama's precious words.

[CitizenBBN]

Even better article on what is going on, an excellent one in fact that dares use history, something he rightly points out Western leaders don't know and don't think is relevant:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2016/...caliphate.html

He points out the same thing I did, that the coup was the Reichstag fire for him, and that the Night of Broken Glass (Kristallnacht) for the secular/intellectual element in Turkey is coming next, and IMO it's what is happening already.

This is Hitler all over again from the standpoint of how he rose to power and the megalomania behind it. Will the outcome be as horrid? that we can't say, but Turkey is slipping into dictatorship the same as Germany in the 1930s.

And our leaders are sitting by just as they did then, all but encouraging it to happen with their inaction.

[dan_bgblue]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/07...tary-coup.html

[dan_bgblue]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/10...adcasting.html

[CitizenBBN]

In what has to be the biggest understatement in history, they are saying the new 3 month extension of the state of emergency is "arousing fears" the crackdown is to concentrate power and undermine democracy.

Really? Ya think? More than 30,000 arrested or fired or otherwise detained in response to a coup? If they had 30,000 people involved the coup would have succeeded.

It's the most obvious effort ever to simply destroy dissent within Turkey to the President. He's going to set himself up as ruler for life just like Putin and the Soviet leaders, Mao, etc. That's so obvious I feel silly typing it.

[PedroDaGr8]

In what has to be the biggest understatement in history, they are saying the new 3 month extension of the state of emergency is "arousing fears" the crackdown is to concentrate power and undermine democracy.

Really? Ya think? More than 30,000 arrested or fired or otherwise detained in response to a coup? If they had 30,000 people involved the coup would have succeeded.

It's the most obvious effort ever to simply destroy dissent within Turkey to the President. He's going to set himself up as ruler for life just like Putin and the Soviet leaders, Mao, etc. That's so obvious I feel silly typing it.

They are already "reforming" the education system. It used to be in Turkish educaiton, you took a science test and if you scored highly you became a teacher. Now, there is an interview component which is weighed VERY heavily. Not surprisingly, the interview questions are all ones that can cast you as either pro-Erdrogan/Islamist or anti-Erdrogan.

[dan_bgblue]

Another coup attempt in the wings?

[dan_bgblue]

Turkey's Erdogan reportedly eyes extending his rule to 2029

[dan_bgblue]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/04...d-recount.html

[CitizenBBN]

Erdogan may have stuffed the ballot box but he'll get his way in the end regardless.

[dan_bgblue]

I think so too. He has ensconced himself in the autocrat position for the foreseeable future. I think it is important for the administration to find way to work with him on the mutually beneficial issues in that part of the world. It needs to be as even a deal as possible and avoid giving away the company store as we are noted for having done in the past

[Catonahottinroof]

2.5 Million votes were likely manipulated in recent referendum

https://www.rt.com/news/385141-turke...es-referendum/

[Doc]

2.5 Million votes were likely manipulated in recent referendum

https://www.rt.com/news/385141-turke...es-referendum/

IMO Russia did it.

[Darrell KSR]

IMO Russia did it.

It's ok, because regular students were included as a well as the athletes.

[dan_bgblue]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017...alf-turks.html