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Thread: One more year of coaching kids' basketball

  1. #1

    One more year of coaching kids' basketball

    Not sure what this season is going to hold for my 7th grade boys basketball team. We were the # 2 team in the league in a 12-team league (beat # 3 by one point with 3 free throws with 0.1 second to play in a classic battle). # 1 team--undefeated for 3 years--lost their top 3 players. # 3 team lost their best player. We return everybody.

    So we're the team to beat, but we have 12 players, with rumors that we may get up to 2 more.

    I'm the school's basketball commissioner, and ultimately, I get to make the decision, but wanted to get thoughts/comments from you on the choice if we end up with 14.

    At 13 players, we have to stick with 1 team. At 14, traditionally, our school will split into two teams, both equally divided as to talent. I'd prefer an "A" team and a "B" team, but it's a long-standing principle at our school that they don't do that. So we'll have two mediocre teams.

    Here are some of the pluses and minuses to having 14 on one team versus two

    One team
    Allows the kids not to be "split up." Allows continued coaching stability. This year we move to high school rules, a 32 minute game, so more time means more ability to play everybody.

    Two teams
    Allows 7 players on a team and all players to get plenty of playing time. Players can develop through games. This is a huge factor, and although most of the factors will relate to one team, playing time is a very important one.

    One team
    Allows intersquad scrimmages and drills with offense and defense, full-court pressure, and beating full-court pressure

    One team
    At our school, we have two competent coaches that coach 7th grade basketball. Nobody else knows anything about basketball at this age. The "other" coach travels, and sent me an email two weeks ago "resigning" from coaching, because he travels Mon through Friday. I asked him to stick around and help me as an assistant, and I would run practices by myself during the week, and attempt to get a practice on Friday evening, which he was thrilled with.

    Two teams
    Major lack of coaching ability on 2nd team. Have spoken to all the parents for three or four years, and have had a couple "help" me during practice, and they are beyond clueless. I don't mean to speak badly of them, and we only have two, 1-hour practices a week, so we're not teaching at a very high level anyway, but these are guys that don't know the rules, don't know a zone defense from a man defense, etc.

    One team
    Two years ago I played my son, who had missed four days of school and was deathly ill, the entire game one game. I played another boy who arrived on crutches and had a broken ankle. We had 6 kids for the game with those two. I swore I would never be placed in that position again (one player was absent from our 7-team roster). I had two kids horribly out of shape to go more than about 2 minutes at a time, and they played almost the entire game. I had the kid with the broken ankle play "offense-only," and we played 4v5 on defense. Dumb stuff like that.

    Two teams
    With two teams, we play each other, which sometimes creates some ill will between classmates. On the other hand, sometimes you have to learn to be a good sport and tolerate winning or losing.

    Personnel
    Of the 12 players we have now, we have one player who is horrible, and does not want to be there. He misses about 50% of the practices. He, and his Dad, appear happy that he's just part of the team. Doesn't matter if he plays 3 minutes in a game, as long as he's part of the team, they are content.

    I have two parents who have been pretty vociferous that they want the kids to play together, and win the league. Well, although I want to win, we don't do this so parents can win through their kids. They also don't want to be split up with their friends, and that one I "get."

    I have one parent who has been pretty vociferous that he wants to see two teams "even if we have 6" players on a team.

    All over the place.

    My internal rule is, at 13 players, it is one team. At 15 players, it is two teams. At 14, we have a major decision to make, given the circumstances. At 14 with my assistant coach being available to coach, we probably have 2 teams.

    Thoughts?

    By the way, we've had 2 practices, and an overall 70.8% team attendance so far. Have had only 5 players make both practices, with 7 players making only 1 of the 2 practices. (I keep attendance, and use that in case a player/parent ever has an issue with playing time.)

    I expect about 75-80% for the season at best. That gives you a picture into the level of commitment.

  2. #2

    Re: One more year of coaching kids' basketball

    Given the attendance and the fact that no one else is available to coach who has a clue, you have one team. You really only have 5-7 kids who are serious about it at all from what I gather, and I'm 10 shades past passionate that those who care shouldn't be disadvantaged by being split up b/c the "everyone gets a trophy" crowd wants some kind of cosmic equality. The 5-7 kids who are willing to at least show up for practices deserve the best chance to compete and win so if splitting teams means that 5-7 now becomes 2-3 kids who care and 3-4 who don't care much I find that wholly unfair.

    Besides the obvious fact that you'd be dooming 2-3 of them to a coach who doesn't know a$$es from elbows in basketball. Seems unfair to them that way too.

    The only downside as I read it of one team is some kids won't play as many minutes. I guess I don't see the problem with that b/c I was at the end of the bench on a few teams as a kid and it was b/c I wasn't as good as other players and it never occurred to me I should play over someone better than me just b/c I have a uniform. If it was playing favorites that's one thing, but not if it's based on performance and merit.

    The obvious problem is you need to avoid what happened last year. If only 5-7 of your kids are reliable, and you split them up, you're looking at 2 teams who both will have the situation of a kid with a busted ankle playing a whole game.

    I have real problems with the best and/or most serious students or athletes being held back by those who don't care as much simply b/c they want a participation trophy. The fact that your school would create 2 mediocre teams (one with no real coaching) and not give the option of having an A and B team based on merit is what breaks the two team deal for me. If you could have an A team of serious players with you as a real coach I'd be pretty neutral, but splitting it up and being unfair to the better kids makes it a no go.
    People keep asking if I'm back and I haven't really had an answer. But now, yeah, I'm thinkin' I'm back.

  3. #3
    Unforgettable
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    Re: One more year of coaching kids' basketball

    Is this a school team or a rec team? If school, are you saying the school does not provide a coach from the athletic dept in middle school? What about football and other sports, do they have parents or paid teacher/ coach?

  4. #4
    School team. They have 24-28 teams in the school, depending on numbers, 1st through 8th grade, boys and girls. This is a 7th grade team. There are no paid coaches for any of the teams. There is no football team.

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  5. #5

    Re: One more year of coaching kids' basketball

    Stakes may have just changed.

    Good solid coach approached me tonight. His son is a 6th grader. He has coached for years, and knows basketball. Works with another school on selecting their players, has assisted coached there, too. He is not happy with the 6th grade coach, and asked me if his son could play "up" to my team. That would give us 13 for sure, and maybe that 14 number. I asked him if he wanted to coach, and he said he would "gladly" coach a team.

    So now add that into the equation. POSSIBLY 13 players, MAYBE 14, and two decent coaches.

    By the way, I had 5 absent from practice today. For the season, I have had 12 absences in 3 practices (33.3% absentee rate).

  6. #6

    Re: One more year of coaching kids' basketball

    So how many total were at practice today? It'll consistently be below 10 right?

    Good news on the 2nd coach no matter which way it ends up.
    People keep asking if I'm back and I haven't really had an answer. But now, yeah, I'm thinkin' I'm back.

  7. #7

    Re: One more year of coaching kids' basketball

    7 present tonight out of 12. I don't think--surely--that this will be the norm. But I am wondering if they've reached the point where the serious ones are coming, and the others are hit-or-miss, because they know by now that they aren't serious players.

  8. #8
    10 of 12 tonight. 70.8% attendance for the year. Three of 12 players have made all 4 practices. Mind is pretty much made up.

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  9. #9
    One and Done Lfbj00's Avatar
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    Re: One more year of coaching kids' basketball

    I know this I'm a little late to this party D, but your son and my son are the same age...12, in the 7th grade. If it was me, after going thru this crap myself, it would be ONE TEAM!! There's a million reasons why, but my number one is, and always will be, that not everybody has to, or needs to play. After doing the coaching thing myself for my son's and daughter's teams, I figured out a while ago that not every kid needs to be in sports. And in some cases, wants to be in sports. It really bothers me when the parents treat a sports team like a babysitting service. I'm not saying you are having this kind of thing going on, but by the sounds of who's actually coming to your practices, there seems to be only a select few that actually care.
    "It's a mere moment in a man's life between an All-Star Game and an Old-Timers Game." - Vin Scully

  10. #10
    You're not late to the party. The coaches' meeting is this Sunday night and that is when I will need to make a decision. Appreciate your input, perfectly timely.

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  11. #11
    We are at 12, coaches meeting last night, and I will have a big team.

    Our school has a policy.

    Teams up to 5th grade, every player should play at least half the game. If 5th grade or later, kids should play one-quarter, but only if the team has 10 or less players.

    If you have more than 10, and 5th grade up, you just use your judgment.

    I will play everybody 8 minutes, or close to it. I can do that without jeopardizing the outcome. But I also tell them that playing time is earned in practice, so I have a lot of discretion in determining who plays, and how much.

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  12. #12
    One and Done Lfbj00's Avatar
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    Re: One more year of coaching kids' basketball

    Sounds like a good decision to make it one team. As for the playing time thing I agree whole-heartedly with your statement about it being earned. If that doesn't motivate some of them to get to practice and work, then they don't need to be playing anyhow. Keep us informed on how your doing Coach!!

    On a side note.... My son got cut from his middle school 7th/8th grade team. They had separate tryouts for each grade, and he was on the team when they made cutdowns, as they took four 7th graders, which was expected, as they were on the 6th grade team last year. But after they had the 8th grade tryouts, and had cutdowns, they kept seven 8th graders, for an 11 man roster. But when they looked at the roster after they combined them, they had 8 forwards and centers, and only 3 guards. So they went back and added on a 8th grader who plays guard, and cut Lawrence. To his credit, he went and asked why, and after they told him the reason, he understood. The coaches there have loyalty to the 8th graders, because this may be the last team some of em ever make. He's still got his aau team, and our local rec league team, so he'll still be playing.

  13. #13

    Re: One more year of coaching kids' basketball

    Quote Originally Posted by Lfbj00 View Post
    Sounds like a good decision to make it one team. As for the playing time thing I agree whole-heartedly with your statement about it being earned. If that doesn't motivate some of them to get to practice and work, then they don't need to be playing anyhow. Keep us informed on how your doing Coach!!

    On a side note.... My son got cut from his middle school 7th/8th grade team. They had separate tryouts for each grade, and he was on the team when they made cutdowns, as they took four 7th graders, which was expected, as they were on the 6th grade team last year. But after they had the 8th grade tryouts, and had cutdowns, they kept seven 8th graders, for an 11 man roster. But when they looked at the roster after they combined them, they had 8 forwards and centers, and only 3 guards. So they went back and added on a 8th grader who plays guard, and cut Lawrence. To his credit, he went and asked why, and after they told him the reason, he understood. The coaches there have loyalty to the 8th graders, because this may be the last team some of em ever make. He's still got his aau team, and our local rec league team, so he'll still be playing.
    Thanks, Lfbj00. Kudos to Lawrence for going to the coach and talking to them. That's a great life lesson in and of itself. The truth is, as much as your son loves basketball (and I'm sure he does), he may have gained more from that experience that making the team and playing, in the long run. Life lessons trump being on a team just for fun.

    Will update from time to time. Our first game is supposed to be December 7, but half our team competes on the school's Science Olympiad team, and they have a regional competition that Saturday, so we'll probably play our first game December 14 (unless we play Sunday, December 8.)

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