In case anyone seriously thinks Trump is a conservative or a Republican...

I've been saying all along I just don't believe him. That's why I voted for Evan McMullin.

It begins:

http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/11/politi...iew/index.html

First look at your news source. Second, no one ever said he was conservative. That was Huckabee and it was Cruz. Trump wasn't Hillary. He had populist ideas. Party label means little to most voters. The President elect and Republicans will get along on issues on which they agree. That might include a wall and ACA reform. It might not include trade and infrastructure. No one will be surprised if he changes his stance on issues. He did that in the campaign. And if he wants to bring the country together he will modify many of his stances. I fully expect it.

Well, a whole bunch of people voted for him thinking he was serious about being a conservative Republican. My view all along has been it was no choice at all between him and his major party opponent. I get what you say about the source, but are you saying they are misreporting it? That was just the source that cropped up first. Google it. It appears that CNN was not misrepresenting his new view. I'll look forward to being proven wrong, but I think until that happens that it never made that much difference whether he or Clinton was elected.

I'm hoping he ends up out of office one way or another and Pence ends up as president. Then we will be making headway.

Pence is much more set in his ways and much less likely to work with the other side to find a compromise on hot button issues.

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Originally Posted by dan_bgblue

Pence is much more set in his ways and much less likely to work with the other side to find a compromise on hot button issues.

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Exactly. He completely won me over with his defense of Indiana's RFRA. I seriously want a president with that kind of backbone on those issues.

People who failed.to look into the candidates didn't realize he wasn't a staunch conservative. He is much more of a centrist with conservative leanings. If you didn't realize that then you were not paying attention

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Originally Posted by Doc

People who failed.to look into the candidates didn't realize he wasn't a staunch conservative. He is much more of a centrist with conservative leanings. If you didn't realize that then you were not paying attention

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That is correct. My point exactly.

There is nothing new there. Pre-existing conditions coverage and the extension of dependent coverage until they reach 26 have been elements of ACA that have long been mentioned as continuing under a different system.

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Originally Posted by Doc

People who failed.to look into the candidates didn't realize he wasn't a staunch conservative. He is much more of a centrist with conservative leanings. If you didn't realize that then you were not paying attention

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Who needed to look into his leanings? We heard it proclaimed for about 18 months that Trump wasn't a true conservative.

The staunch conservatives need to realize that conservatism didn't get Trump elected, his being an anti-establishment populist got him elected.

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Originally Posted by KeithKSR

There is nothing new there. Pre-existing conditions coverage and the extension of dependent coverage until they reach 26 have been elements of ACA that have long been mentioned as continuing under a different system.

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What other people have said in the past really has nothing to do with the point I'm trying to make. I see Trump's own shift as a leading indicator that he is going to move publicly to the left on a lot of issues. He was never what many of his voters thought. This shift on his part (again, whatever others have said up to now about this one issue) is only the beginning. You might as well have voted for Clinton.

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Originally Posted by elicat

I'll look forward to being proven wrong, but I think until that happens that it never made that much difference whether he or Clinton was elected.

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One tremendous difference will be in SCOTUS appointees.

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Originally Posted by KeithKSR

One tremendous difference will be in SCOTUS appointees.

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True.

EDIT: Well, I hope. This is something that could easily slip in the same direction as Obamacare. He could appoint a bunch of Anthony Kennedys.

I think the view reported by CNN has been the view of many conservatives and Republicans. I have no reason to believe Republicans are against covering pre existing conditions or young adults stillliving at home. There will be a national healthcare plan and it won't reject everything in the current ACA The problem with the Afoordable Plan is that it isn't.

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Originally Posted by elicat

What other people have said in the past really has nothing to do with the point I'm trying to make. I see Trump's own shift as a leading indicator that he is going to move publicly to the left on a lot of issues. He was never what many of his voters thought. This shift on his part (again, whatever others have said up to now about this one issue) is only the beginning. You might as well have voted for Clinton.

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I think you have a large segment of the Trump voters mislabeled. A bunch of these people are not conservatives. People in Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin did not have a come to Jesus revelation and turn conservative, they are moderates who the Dems left behind.

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Originally Posted by elicat

Exactly. He completely won me over with his defense of Indiana's RFRA. I seriously want a president with that kind of backbone on those issues.

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There wasn't one who was electable.

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Originally Posted by KeithKSR

I think you have a large segment of the Trump voters mislabeled. A bunch of these people are not conservatives. People in Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin did not have a come to Jesus revelation and turn conservative, they are moderates who the Dems left behind.

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If one's news source is CNN there's a 100% chance you have Trump voters mislabeled.

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Originally Posted by KeithKSR

I think you have a large segment of the Trump voters mislabeled. A bunch of these people are not conservatives. People in Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin did not have a come to Jesus revelation and turn conservative, they are moderates who the Dems left behind.

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Eh, I'm not so sure I have them mislabeled. Those people you point out do exist out there, as do a great many people who intend to be conservative Republicans who somehow allowed themselves to think (mistakenly) that voting for Trump would be consistent with their values and intentions.

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Originally Posted by MickintheHam

If one's [only] news source is CNN there's a 100% chance you have Trump voters mislabeled.

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Fixed that for you.

Trump isn't a conservative, but he's FAR more so than Clinton, who is a socialist when she's not busy selling her office for profit.

Even the House versions that have been passed and never got a hearing in the Senate have kept "parts" of Obamacare. It's all but inevitable some of it will exist in a new law, but what parts are a question. Covering pre-existing conditions is very popular, even the most conservative GOP folks are risking political suicide to scrap some of the things that people feel protect them from the most unscrupulous insurers.

This will be a time that has some frustration for us all policy wise, but it was for sure a better choice than Clinton and he will move the needle overall back to the right. We'll have to see how much as things go forward.

If our choice is a more Populist and less ideologically consistent GOP that is in power or the most liberal version of the Democrats since McGovern in power, I'm going with the former.

If Trump can implement these things in a populist way that maintains their popularity with Joe Average who just put him in office, then the GOP has a HELL of a lot better chance of holding onto these gains and not playing defense from now till the end of days.

Also remember that Obamacare was doomed from the start and its creators knew it. Their plan all along was to use this as a step to purely socialized medicine, the single payer system with government in charge.

Trump will absolutely change that direction for the better, but yes that change will be a step and not a chasm jump. The new plan will still have aspects like covering pre-existing conditions in the mandate.

But this will be a huge change in direction from where we were heading.

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Originally Posted by CitizenBBN

he will move the needle overall back to the right.

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We shall see. I hope you are right, but I will believe it when I see it.

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Originally Posted by elicat

We shall see. I hope you are right, but I will believe it when I see it.

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I'm in wait and see mode as well, but I'm confident it will move right. I just don't know how much.

But I know how much farther left it was going with Hillary, and the absurd tantrums we are now seeing really highlight just how far left it would have gone.

So compared to where we were going it will be a pretty good shift to the right, even if it isn't very far right compared to a traditional view of what is left, right and center.

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Originally Posted by elicat

Fixed that for you.

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You don't need to alter my quotes. There are a lot of news sources just as bad, just as incorrect as CNN. You were apparently exposed to most of them as your only sources to arrive at your understanding of conservatives, progressives and Republicans. Tens of millions of Americans have been duped.

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Originally Posted by MickintheHam

Tens of millions of Americans have been duped.

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I agree.

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Originally Posted by MickintheHam

You don't need to alter my quotes. There are a lot of news sources just as bad, just as incorrect as CNN. You were apparently exposed to most of them as your only sources to arrive at your understanding of conservatives, progressives and Republicans. Tens of millions of Americans have been duped.

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The duping of the masses is why we have rioting going on now. CNN and the like presented Trump to be much more extreme than he is.

And this dustup is the media just trying to undercut him already. Trump has said more than once that there are parts of Obamacare worth keeping, going back to the start of the campaign. In the past he's mentioned the pre-existing condition part, and said a year ago that everyone should be able to get insurance in this country.

Trump has been pretty fungible on many issues during the election, and that won't change. He's not an idealist, he's a pragmatist. This is how Populists work. it's a "just get it done" view of government.

He's one of arguably only two to win an election though, so it should be interesting. Teddy roosevelt probably qualifies as well.

Anybody who believes they were duped by Trump needs to look in the mirror because it wasn't Trump that duped them, it was themselves.