I Love Living Down South Where We Have Our Guns And Our Religion

As that great unifier EX (Love writing that) president Obama once stated.

Alabama has sure been good to me.

Darryl

Cheers. Same in Montana

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Originally Posted by Darryl

As that great unifier EX (Love writing that) president Obama once stated.

Alabama has sure been good to me.

Darryl

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+1

Agree 100%!
Florida has been good to me. And for me.

On a perhaps unrelated note: I wanted to ask the Floridians if it ever stops feeling like the South to you at some point?

When we vacation on the panhandle it seems to have a big "SEC" vibe to it--lots of folks from Louisiana, Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia, etc. When we're in Orlando it feels a lot less that way, more international. And I'm not talking about the theme parks--grocery stores, etc.

(Not that there's anything wrong with that--just different.)

Now now that I live in Naples I can tell you the southern feel here stops once you get past the warm weather. Too many New Yorkers down here to have that accommodating feel....

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Originally Posted by KSRBEvans

On a perhaps unrelated note: I wanted to ask the Floridians if it ever stops feeling like the South to you at some point?

When we vacation on the panhandle it seems to have a big "SEC" vibe to it--lots of folks from Louisiana, Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia, etc. When we're in Orlando it feels a lot less that way, more international. And I'm not talking about the theme parks--grocery stores, etc.

(Not that there's anything wrong with that--just different.)

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I've been lucky/blessed. I have lived in 7 states:

Kentucky, Texas, Tennessee, Florida, Alabama, Alaska and California. And I have visited all 50 states (and one territory ha).

My time in Alabama was the shortest because I was living almost full time with my mom elsewhere but my dad lived in Hoover at the time.

And I can honestly say I loved different things about all of them. I wouldn't fault anyone for living in any of them as they all have positives (in my mind) and weaknesses (in my mind). Alaska was my least favorite place to "live" but its a beautiful place to visit.

I moved back to Florida (was there for a time as a child) on my own accord and really enjoyed it. And then to California when I was 21. And once I was here....I was in for good (22 years now).

I certainly know California's reputation across the U.S. (it scared me to move here because I had many of those same thoughts).

But for me, its perfect (with its many flaws).

Most of the things most would call "weaknesses" here are things I believe in. So I am good sacrificing some of those things for what I consider the greater good. Others wouldn't. And that's great. Its why as adults we all have the ability to live where we want to. But for me, the strengths far outweigh any weaknesses. Its home and I absolutely love it. My favorite things: beaches, weather (lack of humidity and bugs), so many great places to visit and things to do, the diversity, easy access to Mexico (which we adore), etc etc.

I do get asked a decent amount when I meet someone else from the South (since I lived a good portion of my life there): do you miss it? Or what do you miss?

And I always give the same answer. Not the guns because we have those here. I'm not much of a gun person and never fell in love with hunting the way some of my family and friends did (I do enjoy fishing) but we have them if you want them. And my answer is not religion as you can find any church you want on every block in California. I used to miss the food but I eat healthier now so some of the things I used to dream about aren't quite as appealing as they once were or at least I don't want them to be (plus my mom still makes my favorite Gravy and Biscuits in the world).
My answer is always the traditions. I love the cultural traditions in the South. That's a broad term that can mean a lot of things (good and bad). In California, it is such a melting pot that it lacks a lot of the same family, school and community traditions that I remember fondly in the South.

Like I said, everywhere I have lived has good and bad. And I am very thankful I was able to experience them all. I am especially lucky that I spent time in the South as my family has a lot of traditions (like UK basketball) that others here never experience.

So when I read a post like this, it always puts a smile on my face. Because we should love where we live. And we should never want to trade it for anything.

I love living in California and wouldn't trade it for the world.

Like Bigsky said, "Cheers". I think that is the most appropriate response.

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Originally Posted by KSRBEvans

On a perhaps unrelated note: I wanted to ask the Floridians if it ever stops feeling like the South to you at some point?

When we vacation on the panhandle it seems to have a big "SEC" vibe to it--lots of folks from Louisiana, Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia, etc. When we're in Orlando it feels a lot less that way, more international. And I'm not talking about the theme parks--grocery stores, etc.

(Not that there's anything wrong with that--just different.)

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Tim wilson had it right. The South stops at about Gainesville and then you're back up East.

Kentucky will always be home, but I sure like living in Alabama. I find a lot in common between the two states. I spend about 50 to 60 days a year back in Versailles/Lexington and the people are very much the same as they are here.

I love living here in Florida. The only other place I would ever consider living would be the Philippines, but since my bride's parents have passed away, and my youngest brother-in-law is going to move to Australia soon, we will only go to the Philippines for the occasional vacation visit. And truthfully, we'll very likely be traveling to Australia more than the Philippines.

Where I am at is Non-South. Get to the center of the state, ie Okechobee, and it is Southern crossed with Western. Some Johnny Reb Rednecks and lots of horse/cattle people

Now that I live here, I’ll tolerate the Yankees here lol

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Originally Posted by Catonahottinroof

Now that I live here, I’ll tolerate the Yankees here lol

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You haven't had enough exposure to them yet. Just give it some time. Your patience with them will begin to erode, and when it does, you won't want to be around them.
The ones from anywhere in Jersey, New York City, and French-Canadians.

Our neighbors are from Massachusetts. Not bad folks past the accent. We’ve been warned about happy hour and BOGO dinners though.
Best thing the New Yorkers have brought with them is pizza and bagels. Good stuff around here.

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Originally Posted by suncat05

You haven't had enough exposure to them yet. Just give it some time. Your patience with them will begin to erode, and when it does, you won't want to be around them.
The ones from anywhere in Jersey, New York City, and French-Canadians.

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Yeah, those guys from Massachusetts are really big on 'paaaaaarking the caaaaaar in the gaaaaaarage. 😂

I've had several friends from New York State. They loved keg parties, Hank Junior, beans and taters, and were a kind and soft heart'd bunch.
And they do not consider NYC dwellers representative of the State. More like a mosh-pit of international diversity.

Fixed it lol

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Originally Posted by suncat05

Yeah, those guys from Massachusetts are really big on 'paaaaaarking the caaaaaar so farrrrr from the baaaaaarrrrrr. ��

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😂

THAT is great stuff right there, Catonahottinroof! Kudos!

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Originally Posted by kingcat

I've had several friends from New York State. They loved keg parties, Hank Junior, beans and taters, and were a kind and soft heart'd bunch.
And they do not consider NYC dwellers representative of the State. More like a mosh-pit of international diversity.

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A guy I graduated with back in 1995 was from New York and was and still is one of the biggest rednecks in several counties. He always explained to anyone who would listen “there are two New York’s. New York City which everyone knows and New York Country where I’m from usually on the outskirts of a dairy farm and a Walmart”.

I’ve been in 46 states, Mexico and Canada during my travels. I’ve been lucky enough to meet all kinds of wonderful people everywhere and truly see the beauty of this country from coast to coast. If I ever had to live anywhere besides Jamestown KY, it would be panhandle Florida, Northeast Texas or anywhere in Alabama. Are these spots the best? Maybe, maybe not. I’m sure opinions vary.

Now the one place you could never get me to live would be California. Just not my cup of tea. However, I will say that Cali doesn’t get enough credit for its beauty. From the mountains in north to the beautiful farmland in the San Joaquin Valley, and even the barren desert in the south, California has a lot of beauty. In my 13 years traveling the roads, the drive down US Highway 101 is still the most beautiful I’ve seen.

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Originally Posted by TRUCKERCATFAN

I’ve been in 46 states, Mexico and Canada during my travels. I’ve been lucky enough to meet all kinds of wonderful people everywhere and truly see the beauty of this country from coast to coast. If I ever had to live anywhere besides Jamestown KY, it would be panhandle Florida, Northeast Texas or anywhere in Alabama. Are these spots the best? Maybe, maybe not. I’m sure opinions vary.

Now the one place you could never get me to live would be California. Just not my cup of tea. However, I will say that Cali doesn’t get enough credit for its beauty. From the mountains in north to the beautiful farmland in the San Joaquin Valley, and even the barren desert in the south, California has a lot of beauty. In my 13 years traveling the roads, the drive down US Highway 101 is still the most beautiful I’ve seen.

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I would agree. Our dream destination is Colorado, which is where we will be retiring. FL gets old. I like seasons and like snow so 26 years here is plenty. As for California, it is the people and cost of living that make it unpalatable. I was born there and been back many time to see the natural beauty of the state. It is the people I don't get. People with jobs who are homeless because the can not affort to own a home or rent one? Years ago (20?) we drove by the home we rented when I was born. Literally a 60 x 60 cinderblock pillbox on maybe a 1/4 acre lot just outside San Jose, on the market for over $1,000,000. Had a beautiful view of a strip mall parking lot. We were in San Fran last summer and conatantly accousted by homeless. Now many California's will claim the climate draws the homeless. I live in FL which has a similar climate and we don't have human feces on our streets.

So yeah, Florida is great if you like the environment. I find the panhandle a bit of a tweener climate wise and tourist wise. Winter are sort of crappy but not snow crappy. And much of it is touristy trappy, but that is me. I am due east of the big lake in FL, on the Atlantic coast. That is the farthest south I would consider (Jupiter/West Palm Beach....twist my arm and maybe Boca Raton work). Once south its just the megalopolis of Lauderdale/Miami and English becomes a second language

California is 163,000 square miles. The homeless problem that is somehow on the front page of Fox News every single day (including right at this very moment) is in two cities: Downtown LA and Downtown SF. I wouldn't want to live in either city so it certainly doesn't affect me. And its completely overblown in relation to the rest of the state (and even in relation to the surrounding areas around that city). I am not downplaying its issues there. I love visiting SF and its tiresome seeing and dealing with the homeless. They need to fix it. I am just saying that with the size of California, saying that "California has a homeless problem" would be like people in Raleigh, North Carolina being concerned over the subway homeless in NYC (same relative distance).
I suspect just about everyone knows that Newsom will be the Dem nominee in 2024 (especially if Trump wins) so anything and everything about California is constantly on Fox News.

As for the housing prices being high...bring it on! Ha. I own my home so I am hoping for them to skyrocket.

Again, I have lived all over America (and been in all 50 states). Much of America has a weird fixation/fascination with California I will never quite understand. When I travel and people ask where I am from, its just funny seeing their reaction. The VAST majority of the time, their stereotype is so far removed from my everyday life that its comical.

In 2017, Los Angeles County reported, to Judicial Watch, 144% more registered voters than there were citizens of a legal voting age in the county. They reported 112% overage to the state in 2017.

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-...g-age-citizens

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Originally Posted by ukpumacat

California is 163,000 square miles. The homeless problem that is somehow on the front page of Fox News every single day (including right at this very moment) is in two cities: Downtown LA and Downtown SF. I wouldn't want to live in either city so it certainly doesn't affect me. And its completely overblown in relation to the rest of the state (and even in relation to the surrounding areas around that city). I am not downplaying its issues there. I love visiting SF and its tiresome seeing and dealing with the homeless. They need to fix it. I am just saying that with the size of California, saying that "California has a homeless problem" would be like people in Raleigh, North Carolina being concerned over the subway homeless in NYC (same relative distance).
I suspect just about everyone knows that Newsom will be the Dem nominee in 2024 (especially if Trump wins) so anything and everything about California is constantly on Fox News.

As for the housing prices being high...bring it on! Ha. I own my home so I am hoping for them to skyrocket.

Again, I have lived all over America (and been in all 50 states). Much of America has a weird fixation/fascination with California I will never quite understand. When I travel and people ask where I am from, its just funny seeing their reaction. The VAST majority of the time, their stereotype is so far removed from my everyday life that its comical.

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Its fine if you
1) don't live in those city or
2) you don't visit those cities

It was far from overblown when I had a psychotic 250 black man in a dirty wife beater following me and my family at 10pm SCREAMING to stop the voices in his head in downtown San Fran last summer. It sure did not seem overblown when the guy camped out front of our hotel was acousting patrons to the point the hotel manager came running out as he called the police. Nor did it seem overblown when some junkie was shooting what I assume was heroine on the street by the window as we were eating breakfast. None of which was on "FOXNEWS" but was seen by me. Fortunately I didn't step in any human feces while I was there. So minimize your states problems. Bottom line is that the is a problem in those cities. It may not affect you personally but that does not mean there is no problem, just not one you can ignore if you want and not care about.

As for the home prices, it exacerbates the problem. Had a long discussion with our Uber driver over it and he explained it quite well. It was an issue to him because the homeless pbm is an issue to him since he has to interact with the filth and disqust that is pervasive throughout the city

As for any weird fixation...not really. I only care because I was there, because I don't like to see any animal, be it pet or human, live in filth and substandard conditions regardless of location, and because I see it as a direction the ENTIRE country is going and the thought of that being constantly in view of me and my family is revolting. If you Californians like it or even tolerate it then MORE POWER TO YOU if you can assure me that like Vegas...what happens in California stays in California.

According to the market watch link, California has 47% of the nation’s homeless people. It’s on the news....because it is news.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/th...-us-2019-09-18

California gets the image for two reasons IMO:

1) yes, the perception that "California" is LA and San Fran, etc. But that's the same as New York, which is dominated in image by NYC.

2) Cali politicians have long seen themselves as leaders in policy and issues, and in fact a lot of things they go after do filter up to become national points of the left leaning agenda. So things seen in the news like banning straws usually happens in cali first then becomes a more national debate or issue.

I think that's accurate, they do lead on a lot of those issues. The point being that a lot of the country thinks it's leading in the wrong direction.



that all being said, if you run the numbers, much of Cali is red, it's just that the major cities are so large and so blue the run the state, just like Illinois and New York.

In fact if you just took a crowbar and pushed greater San Fran out of the state and the Union, and certainly if you did San Fran and LA, Cali would be come pretty solidly red and just about lock up GOP wins in national elections. Obviously their electoral count drops a lot, but it would give a real red lean to things.


The other reason Cali should get attention is the political corruption of having a one party system. Democrats have been able to build corruption and disenfranchisement right into their system.

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Originally Posted by Doc

I live in FL which has a similar climate and we don't have human feces on our streets.

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The problem is bad enough in San Fran that a poop map exists:
Story about poop map

And per another article San Fran employs 5 people - to clean up human st*t!!:
"Nobody doubts that San Francisco’s streets are getting dirtier. Last year, then-Mayor Mark Farrell directed an extra $12.8 million toward street cleaning in response to public complaints, including a five-person “poop patrol” specifically aimed at feces-related complaints."

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Originally Posted by Doc

Its fine if you
1) don't live in those city or
2) you don't visit those cities

It was far from overblown when I had a psychotic 250 black man in a dirty wife beater following me and my family at 10pm SCREAMING to stop the voices in his head in downtown San Fran last summer. It sure did not seem overblown when the guy camped out front of our hotel was acousting patrons to the point the hotel manager came running out as he called the police. Nor did it seem overblown when some junkie was shooting what I assume was heroine on the street by the window as we were eating breakfast. None of which was on "FOXNEWS" but was seen by me. Fortunately I didn't step in any human feces while I was there. So minimize your states problems. Bottom line is that the is a problem in those cities. It may not affect you personally but that does not mean there is no problem, just not one you can ignore if you want and not care about.

As for the home prices, it exacerbates the problem. Had a long discussion with our Uber driver over it and he explained it quite well. It was an issue to him because the homeless pbm is an issue to him since he has to interact with the filth and disqust that is pervasive throughout the city

As for any weird fixation...not really. I only care because I was there, because I don't like to see any animal, be it pet or human, live in filth and substandard conditions regardless of location, and because I see it as a direction the ENTIRE country is going and the thought of that being constantly in view of me and my family is revolting. If you Californians like it or even tolerate it then MORE POWER TO YOU if you can assure me that like Vegas...what happens in California stays in California.

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This is the problem....you are talking about San Francisco. Not "California". As you know, this is a GIGANTIC state. So because something happens in one city 8.5 hours away (which in most of the US is several states away) does not mean that its a "California" problem. But no one ever says, "I would never live in San Francisco because of the homeless". They spray paint the entire state.

I have experienced that exact same scenario you described with your family in large cities all over the world. I was on a beach in Ft. Lauderdale at 10am and had to literally pack all of my stuff up and leave because a homeless man who was tripping on heroin wanted to lay on our towels. But I don't paint the entire state of Florida that way. Big cities deal with different problems. Downtown San Francisco has a serious homeless problem. THAT isn't overblown. So does downtown LA. But "California" doesn't. THAT is overblown.
But the headlines on Fox News will always say "California". Like its rampant across the state or something. And that is just silly.

Its like saying that a tourist should avoid a certain neighborhood of Miami because of a drug cartel and therefore Pensacola better beware.

And like Chuck's other thread.....these people are by in large not homeless because of home prices. That is just simply not true. They are homeless because of drug/alcohol use and/or mental illness.

Btw, on a related but more personal note....

Anytime I visit SF (and I love that city to visit) it baffles me that there are any homeless people there. San Diego...oh I would get that. LA, same. But SF?? Even on a hot summer day, it gets FREEZING there most nights. The wind is ruthless.

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Originally Posted by ukpumacat

This is the problem....you are talking about San Francisco. Not "California". As you know, this is a GIGANTIC state. So because something happens in one city 8.5 hours away (which in most of the US is several states away) does not mean that its a "California" problem. But no one ever says, "I would never live in San Francisco because of the homeless". They spray paint the entire state.

I have experienced that exact same scenario you described with your family in large cities all over the world. I was on a beach in Ft. Lauderdale at 10am and had to literally pack all of my stuff up and leave because a homeless man who was tripping on heroin wanted to lay on our towels. But I don't paint the entire state of Florida that way. Big cities deal with different problems. Downtown San Francisco has a serious homeless problem. THAT isn't overblown. So does downtown LA. But "California" doesn't. THAT is overblown.
But the headlines on Fox News will always say "California". Like its rampant across the state or something. And that is just silly.

Its like saying that a tourist should avoid a certain neighborhood of Miami because of a drug cartel and therefore Pensacola better beware.

And like Chuck's other thread.....these people are by in large not homeless because of home prices. That is just simply not true. They are homeless because of drug/alcohol use and/or mental illness.

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Did you not read the linked article?

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Originally Posted by Catonahottinroof

According to the market watch link, California has 47% of the nation’s homeless people. It’s on the news....because it is news.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/th...-us-2019-09-18

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At the city level, four of the five cities with the highest rate of unsheltered homelessness are in California: San Francisco, Los Angeles, Santa Rosa and San Jose. Seattle joins the California municipalities in the top five.

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Its not just San Francisico. Saying it just selected areas is silly. That is like claiming there is not homeless problem in America because its a large nations. It is a problem because it is not being adequately addressed! But realistically, does it matter if CA is a big place? The issues in LA and SF are unique due to how extensive it is in those locations. I have never had to maneuver around human waste in Miami, a place I visit frequently. Nor do I have psychotic homeless people chase me down in the street screaming in my face. There are not "tent cities" inhabited by heroine shooting junkies. There is no fear of Cholera or the Plague in Miami, like there is in San Fran and LA. You can try to minimize the political lure of California to the homeless by deflecting to other states but reality is that it IS A PROBLEM in California. Does Lauderdale have selected pockets of issues with homelessness/high crime/drug use? Sure. So does Miami, NYC, Detroit, etc. but that does not justify ignoring the problems. As for your issues in Lauderdale, Florida is a big state too, with lots of beaches, hence its not a problem here. See, it sounds stupid when I use that logic too. Likewise you claim it is a Foxnews derived issue fails. Numerous NON-Fox sites have similar reports. this link, from the federal gov't which is hardly a fox friendly site, has CA as the number #1 homeless state with almost 50% more than #2 (NY)

I get it. You love your state. I don't disagree that CA is a beautiful, and large, place. But they do have a homeless issue. That issue is using up state tax dollars. Dollars from the entire large state. Additionally it is driving away tourism from the entire large state, which also hurts revenue and business owners in the state. And until the state addresses the problem, it will continue to be a problem.

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Originally Posted by Doc

I get it. You love your state. I don't disagree that CA is a beautiful, and large, place. But they do have a homeless issue. That issue is using up state tax dollars. Dollars from the entire large state. Additionally it is driving away tourism from the entire large state, which also hurts revenue and business owners in the state. And until the state addresses the problem, it will continue to be a problem.

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I don't disagree with any of that. Your sentence about tourism is really my entire point. There is a false idea in some peoples minds that if they go to "California" they are going to be stepping over homeless feces left and right. They aren't.
If they go to downtown SF they might. Or parts of downtown LA.
In fact, I wouldn't recommend going to either of those cities right now if someone is worried or skirmish etc about seeing those things. Because they are without a doubt there.

But there are hundreds of other gorgeous places in California to visit where you will never see anything like that.

I am not saying YOU, as in Doc is spreading a false narrative. I am saying its out there. That this is how "California" is. Its not. Its how a few big cities in California is. Don't go there then. But there is a heck of a lot more to the state where it isn't. FAR more than where it is.

And I wouldn't mind if it hurt tourism a bit. Ha. Tourism is "booming". It grew for the 7th straight year. https://www.vcstar.com/story/money/b...ow/1092489001/

Personally, I've never understood why anyone goes to "Hollywood". I hate that city. Its dirty and filled with teenagers high on something who ran away from home.

But San Diego (which has homeless but has done a much better job dealing with it), Santa Barbara, Palm Springs, Napa/Sonoma, etc etc are large areas and GORGEOUS places to visit where you will rarely see anything described above.

I am not denying that it’s an issue. As I said, I’ve been on the front line of this as a board member of a non profit for years.
It’s just, some cities have done a much better job than others.
It’s a local issue. Far more than a state one.

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Originally Posted by ukpumacat

I am not denying that it’s an issue. As I said, I’ve been on the front line of this as a board member of a non profit for years.
It’s just, some cities have done a much better job than others.
It’s a local issue. Far more than a state one.

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Can't argue that, and it's no coincidence the deep blue cities in California have the biggest problems, and the redder ones have less issue.

You subsidize things you want to encourage, tax things you want to discourage. lexington's homeless problem is growing as our services for the homeless expand, and it's not a freak coincidence. We're attracting the homeless (and non-homeless who just want to come hang out in the summer) by offering more and more services and free stuff, then we're surprised people react and show up to receive the benefits.

These people are crazy and stoned, but not dumb.

Homeless death rate up in LA. Drug and alcohol abuse the leading cause

Interesting take, a conservative slant, but it is kinda hard to deny the one party system in place in California. And this little blurb which I’m gonna check out on the web this evening.

“Has California become premodern?

Millions of fed-up middle-class taxpayers have fled the state. Their presence as a stabilizing influence is sorely missed. About one-third of the nation's welfare recipients live in California. Millions of poor newcomers require enormously expensive state health, housing, education, legal and law-enforcement services.”

https://townhall.com/columnists/vict...odern-n2555588

California's Prop 47 leads to rise in shoplifting, thefts, criminal activity across state

This thread cracks me up. 17 straight posts about California after I posted that America has some weird fixation with it.

People can keep writing articles about it. They can talk about how many people move out of the state (and never mention the #1 reason: to retire. Their home value is so high they can sell here, buy a mansion in Nevada and live off the rest for retirement). And politicizing natural disasters and pretending its because California is liberal and that's why. Taxes. Regulations. Homelessness. On and on.

Meanwhile, our home values (meaning equity) continue to soar (mostly because people actually want to live here). Our tourism is booming. We are still the most visited state in the United States (because people love seeing Armageddon and poop all over the streets I am sure).
We have the largest economy in the United States, 5th largest in the world and yet we are ranked as the 4th healthiest economy in the United States (https://wallethub.com/edu/states-wit...onomies/21697/). Kentucky is 45th...just fyi.

We have had 7 straight years of economic growth (which is why Newsom is so popular here despite the national press coverage).

As the world's 5th largest economy, California outpaces the United States in job growth, manufacturing, personal income, corporate profits and the total return of its bonds (https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/ar...y-outpaces-u-s).

Keep hating all. Keep finding articles (there are plenty of them. Usually 2-3 on FoxNews.com every day). Keep posting until your hearts are content. California can be the Evil Empire for every other state.

And I will enjoy my soaring home equity, 80 degrees with no humidity (literally today), beaches, breweries, booming economy, wine country and one of the most diverse states in the United States. Oh, and we have guns and churches too if thats your thing.

And when any of you come visit, which many inevitably will, I will be glad to guide you around the piles of poop, the homeless, the caravans of people moving out of the state, the liberal hippies playing hacky-sack in the streets and buy you your first drink in a bar full of miserable people who can't wait to move.

Puma, California's weather is insanely good. No doubt.

And yes the rest of the state gets painted with the extremes of San Francisco and LA. But that's true of every state. Texas gets painted as cowboys, despite the fact that it's not even close, kentucky as hillbillies, etc. That's true of every state.

The reason why Cali gets the image isn't just press coverage selection, though that's a lot of it. It's also b/c Cali is a single party state and thus and for many years has been an early bellweather of implementing policies that frankly most of the country finds to be extreme.

Those policies often then trickle out nationally, so yes a lot of people, esp. in redder states, do see Cali as having some kind of evil force going on, b/c it seems to be the kicking off point for a lot of things people in other parts of the country don't like and/or outright despise.

That's what draws the ire as much as anything. I know Texans very unhappy with Cali people moving there b/c they bring their liberal ideas with them, and it's mostly liberals moving there b/c as you said it's urban home values that are driving some of their retirement moves, that and lower taxes.

Florida is full of people retiring b/c of lack of income taxes. So some of it is home values, but some is taxation.

And no doubt Cali has a booming economy, driven by being the center of American tech industry for the most part, along with being the port of call for our trade with the Pacific.

So while Cali has "the 5th largest economy in the world", a LOT of that is due to the fact that it's the port for the other 47 states in the mainland US. It's not all Cali's doing b/c everyone is consuming all the cheap Chinese junk that lands in LA.

But that doesn't mean they arent' slowly killing the golden goose either. maybe not as bad as New York, which frankly has crappy weather and not nearly as much else to offer as California, but it's going to happen.

Cali also has a huge real estate market, which gets counted in GDP but is a bit misleading. When all those very expensive home sell that goes into GDP but it's tough to translate that to quality of life etc.. In some ways real estate, in every state, is a bit misleading when added to GDP numbers b/c the basis grows but it's almost all paper money, not really re-invested as capital in the way growth in manufacturing for example would impact an area economy.

It became a discussion of Cali in part b/c of your posts, and there's good and bad there like everywhere.

I will tell you the one place Cali deserves FAR more criticism than it gets. It's essentially no longer a democratic government. The one party rule has so distorted the notion of fair voting that it's questionable if there are really any fair elections left in the state.

That's an extreme statement but I stand by it. When someone is sent to jail in North Carolina, not known for it's great election laws either, for something (hand harvesting of other people's ballots) that is outright encouraged in California, something isn't right. the state Democratic party has intentionally built huge flaws into the chain of custody for ballots there just to insure their grassroots people can stuff the ballot box.

It's a constitutional travesty and crisis IMO, far worse than the homeless problem.

Just looked it up, and GDP of Cali has the largest segment as finance, insurance, real estate and leasing. Almost $538 billion. The problem is a lot of that doesn't really count as economically "growing the pie", i.e. producing actual things to meet consumer needs. Sure they need housing, but the fact that housing there is so costly inflates that number greatly.

Providing an apartment there for $3K that is the same as one in Lexington for $500 doesn't mean California has added $2,500 more in economic growth to the nation. It just means their housing is that much more expensive.

In a way it's an economic sump. Fine art, gold, same thing. You can buy low and sell high and make money, but the investment in it doesn't actually expand the economy. Now, investing in new real estate or upgrading does have some non-sump value, so it's not 100% like fine art, but a lot of the value of what is transacting in Cali and any other state is really just paper wealth and not actually helping people by expanding the goods and services available to the nation.

That's not particular to Cali, all states have that number in their calculation, but it's huge in Cali's case b/c of the cost of real estate.

it's also hard to break it out in Cali and New York b/c it does I believe include financial services, which obviously in New York is huge beyond real estate, and is very big in California.

But look at Kentucky. manufacturing is #1, Finance/Real estate is #2, Government #3, Education #4.

To Cali's credit, government is 5th or 6th. That's another big sump.

It's all a fair measure b/c it's the same for all states, but it's also misleading overall as a statistic as to what's going on economically.