That was when he made the comment about not wanting his kids in a racial jungle. Talk about "dog whistles"!Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenBBN
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That was when he made the comment about not wanting his kids in a racial jungle. Talk about "dog whistles"!Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenBBN
I've linked a really good article on it, I think from very left Politico, detailing how he basically bailed out Jessie Helms and blocked it, b/c he went back to his constituents and found out that they didn't want integration.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc
He's a pure politician. He has no beliefs other than staying in power. When being tough on crime was popular he worked with Clinton to put forward the crime bill that locked up huge numbers of minorities on relatively minor drug offenses, and yet still claims to be such a strong supporter of minority causes. Where was he for 8 years with Obama while people complained about that law? Where was his policy initiative to address it?
It's his mission in life to stay elected, not to actually accomplish anything.
Just so everyone knows, I deleted my comments only because I don’t want to appear to argue with my friends. And anytime I can avoid that from now on I’ll try to do that.
Disagreement is taken the wrong way all too often anymore. And this type of stuff just isn’t that important in reality. Debates are to help form an opinion, and each opinion should be respected and highly valued. Our vote is all that matters and I am for everyone voting their conscience regardless of what the vote is.
Just didn’t want anyone to think I was mad or being defensive in any way. It’s not politics as usual anymore and it’s hard to discuss for everyone unless it is the appropriate forum for ones own views. Thats the state of things almost everywhere not just here.
I wish Trump spent less time interrupting. By doing so he didn't give Joe time to stick his foot in his mouth. I'm betting next debate Trump gives Joe more uninterrupted time.
I appreciate that, and by your delivery in your posts, you certainly seem like a fair and good guy (although maybe misguided politically :tongue08:). I feel the same way but I realize sometimes my posts will be interpreted as confrontational. It's somewhat the nature of non personal communication.Quote:
Originally Posted by kingcat
Btw, I don't condone Trumps answer, I just dont think it is fair to smear that group as white supremacists. They claim they are not, to me their actions suggest they are not, and the evidence is lacking to call them white supremacists. It's a common smear tactic of the left and once it starts, it sticks.
That was a big mistake by Trump, IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc
He's a horrible debater. Really he's had about 4-5 good speeches/events in his entire run, when he calms down, takes a Valium and tries to project being Presidential.Quote:
Originally Posted by KeithKSR
He seems convinced people want the New York roughhouser, the put down artist, the Apprentice guy, and he couldn't be more wrong.
He could have sailed to a 2nd term even with Covid if he had just stopped with the dumbassery and stayed on message during his term. Even the media blitz and Trump Derangement Syndrome wouldn't have worked if he just worked on his personality some.
He's his own worst enemy more than any elected official I can recall.
Lindsey Graham posted on twitter that they are a "racist organization antithetical to American ideals".Quote:
Originally Posted by Basket Case
Agreed.Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenBBN
Ive had no problem with any response to what i believe in this thread, or any other of late. I guess if you can imagine a party where one guy goes against the grain with everything that is discussed, proposed, or eaten and wants it his or her way and wont shut up about it. Thats the way Im concerned it appears at times.Quote:
Originally Posted by Basket Case
Like a vegetarian, non drinking jazz lover in shorts and flip flops at an indoor BBQ/pony kegger or the like. ;)
SPLC is er, um, well, a good example of what it claims to be against.
The thing is he's not a bad actor. If he thought that was the way to go I think he could probably pull it off, with some missteps and reverting to the New York tough guy here and there. But he could probably have generally been "Presidential" and if he had this isn't even a discussion. He'd have big negatives, but enough people who wouldn't want to change directions in troubled times, they would have some basic faith in him.Quote:
Originally Posted by ukpumacat
But he's so erratic, so over the top, they don't feel like we're on a path currently, so changing is easier.
Listened to the rage book on our way to Hilton head today. Trump is just an awful human, and I agree with what most have said on both sides in this thread. He just can’t get past himself and being a total damn narcissist. The guys is such a loose cannon I’m not sure he needs to be in office. Is there a big slant to Woodward’s book? I tried to look at opinions on him and seems to get a fair shake. I’m pretty new to even considering listening to politics, but that book is very educational. What always has struck me is this, why do people so blindly and desperately follow trump but at the same time admit he is horrible? We all agree there. I mean he chose some really seemingly high quality people for his cabinet positions who seem to be sharp successful and American through and through, and then ran them into the ground by undermining their jobs with out of the blue decisions that get revealed on Twitter? I mean come on guys I know Biden isn’t the answer and I’m cool with going against the grain of old politics and I freaking hate this crying on racism movement that is the least of the black communities problem, but this guy is a disaster. I just don’t know what the answer is, and I’ll admit I don’t have a lot of political knowledge but I do typically feel confident with my reads on people and situations.
I myself have just started to follow politics,
What caught my attention is the strong push by the Democrats for a socialist government and constantly wanting to raise taxes, the tearing down of the constitution and radical push in Democratic run cities to defund the police.
Yes Trump is what appears to be a bad person on the surface but he is a true American.
One huge thing going against him is this media driven narrative that hates him.
Democrats seem to support many groups that go against my beliefs and some like BLM are nothing but domestic terrorist groups.
It’s the American values and not Trump that I am voting Republican.
Yep, and this has always been my idea as well. I do need to look at the dems harder because all I hear about is trump in the media. So much noise you have to wade through it.Quote:
Originally Posted by catmanjack
I am not sure I would label him an "awful human". He is a bombastic petulant blowhard (aka a typical New Yorker). He is portrayed as an awful human, and in part that is his own doing. Unfortunately the good things he has done are seldom presented.Quote:
Originally Posted by Padukacat
But for me, I only care about POLICY. What he says means little, but what he does says plenty. Sort of the antithesis of Obama, who by appearances was a great guy but what he did not so much. I don't like that Trump called Rosie a fat pig but I like that he cut taxes. I don't like that he made fun of John McCain but I like that he passed justice reform. I could go on but no need to.
But Trumps appeal to many is that he is not a politician. Never was, does not claim to be and has no desire to be one. I for one am tired of the hypocrisy of our government. Say one thing, do another. Accuse the opposition of something that you are doing and have been doing for decades. Do anything at all costs for power and money, even if its to the detriment of the country.
You feel he is a loose cannon. Could you please expand on that? What has he done that merits that label? Justice reform? Tax Cuts? Deregulation? Easing tensions with N Korea? Requiring cities follow the laws passed by congress rather than exempting themselves by being "Sanctuary Cities"? Trying to enforce our borders? In my book a loose cannon would be somebody who spies on their political opponents by using and deceiving government agencies to do so.
Many people are sick an tired of "politics as usual" where our freedoms and choices are bartered out to the highest bidder. Many want the 3 branches of government to work together to solve the problems. Trump ran on draining the Washington Swamp, and was elected to do so. Washington's response was to "get him". 4 years of trying to nullify the election has worn thin. I don't like Trump, probably wouldn't invite him to my house or share a brew with him. However what I will do is take advantage of his actions and accomplishments, and overlook his petulance. Because he isn't the worse option. A worse option is letting the swamp continue to grow at the citizens expense.
I'm sure Trump is a complete ass to work for, have said it from the start.Quote:
Originally Posted by Padukacat
Now is he evil as many think? No, he isn't. He's pompous, boorish, a narcissist, no doubt, but that describes a lot of powerful New Yorkers. But he's not evil, he's not a Russian Double Knot Spy, etc.
And in 4 years we've had to put up with his being an ass all the time, but he hasn't done anything to undermine the nation or put us in harm's way, and he's actually accomplished some very positive things. I think he's done so in spite of his personality and not because of it, which is his key failing in understanding he's actually the one holding himself back, but the results have still been a net positive.
Biden is I'm sure a much nicer person to work with, but he's also a pure politician, so his only goal is to be elected. he doesn't BELIEVE in anything in particular, which you can see when you look at the arc of his career.
And Biden will usher in more voice for the true threat to this nation, which is a radical leftist movement that condemns free speech and expression, free markets and American exceptionalism.
So the choice is to put up with a man whose tweets are offensive and who will run through staff like water, but who has in 4 years generally done good things and will definitely stay the course on free speech (he's pushing to defend it on campuses, etc. as a matter of policy), free markets and a basic belief that America is a good nation versus an evil one, or a man who I'm sure is much nicer but who is also a stuffed shirt who has no direction, may not be all there, and who will help give rise to the most radical elements of the Left that truly endanger us.
It's an ugly choice, but most choices for POTUS are ugly choices, esp. for a Libertarian. Reagan was the last choice I actually liked, and prior to that, though I couldn't have voted obviously, I think you'd have to go back to maybe Eisenhower to find someone truly positive.
Trump is an ass, Biden is a clown. In the end neither should be running the free world, so for me it comes down to what policies will they pursue? Trump has put judges on the bench who believe in interpreting the law and not making it, he's improved the strength of NATO and our hegemony in the Middle East and Eastern Europe, and he's the first POTUS since the 1950s to see China as the real threat to American superiority in the world.
I had hoped the office would temper Trump's personality some, but it hasn't, but looking at the last 4 years I see more of the issues being people losing their minds over him than actual policies he's pursued. I still have yet to be presented one single thing he's done that I think undermines our nation in any way that isn't simply a policy disagreement.
He's embarrassing, but it's better than ending the senate filibuster, moving further towards real socialism, pursuing the Green New Deal, enacting hate speech laws, a $15 minimum wage, or any other number of things Biden has both endorsed and then distanced himself from depending on what best suited him that month.
For me it's an easy choice, if a distasteful one.
I'd prefer the rise of a true Libertarian party, one that believes in individual liberty and staying out of people's business, but while I was optimistic that might happen when I was 20 and even 30, now I see this as a slow death spiral for the American Experiment, as we descend into socialism and the euphemistic "social justice" which is just a polite term for some lite version of Marxism where we take from each according to ability and give to each according to need, with all of that determined by some state agency.
And fwiw I imagine most people who serve in the Trump White House do so out of a desire to temper him and try to pursue what is best for America, and only put up with Trump for as long as they can in order to accomplish those broader goals. I doubt seriously if he is respected.
But, despite it being horribly dysfunctional, it seems to be holding up, and Trump's behavior hasn't become more than an embarrassment at times. Not good, but better than Hillary's deep corruption, or Biden's family corruption, or in this case Biden's purely political view of the world.
Despite his obvious personality issues, he's actually generally stayed the course on his campaign promises, so if that's what one wants he's generally delivered, at least as well or better than most any other POTUS.
And his work in the Middle East is truly unsung, b/c he's actually made some strides there. I'm sure the credit for all the water carrying goes to others, but at least he's pursued that direction.
An awful lot of the perceived dysfunction of the White House seems to come from those who were on the inside that sought to steer Trump in ways to achieve their own goals. From all accounts Trump is one of these guys that wants dissenting opinions and will weigh those opinions and make the final decisions. Those who have become disenchanted outsiders are those who couldn’t manage not getting their way, like Bolton, Mattis, Kelly, etc., warhawks that thought they could mold a President who was intent on peace.
Look at all the RINOs who dislike Trump, they do so because he isn’t controlled by the Swamp, like most presidents have been.
When was the last time we heard news reports about Isis? What about North Korean missiles?Trump is trying to draw down troop numbers all around the world. The a Trump doctrine sure seems like it is making the world safer.
China now has a huge financial piece of the US pie.
Yes, Trump tends to like different opinions on his staff, and I do think that's part of the conflict.Quote:
Originally Posted by KeithKSR
And in foreign policy Trump wants to extract the US from these endless conflicts, and a lot of military and DC people don't like that idea, even though Trump is pro military. Bolton is a great example. I'm sure he was livid the US didn't retaliate for the oil field strikes.
There are a lot of different opinions in the White House, and they all use the media to try to manipulate things to their view.
Some of Trump is "loose cannon", but yes some of it is just not bending his knee to the establishment and their way of thinking.
I'm sure he's an ass to work for, but I respect that he campaigned on things like reducing US troop levels in these theaters and getting allies to pay more of the costs, and he's done that in multiple areas. The problem for him hiring in the foreign policy area is that most conservatives these days who would work for a GOP administration are neo-cons, and Trump is closer to Rand Paul than he is any typical Republican on foreign policy.
He's an ass, and his style is abrasive, combative, and internally competitive, which is everything insider Washington is not, but he's actually done OK with it. I think he would do better to tone it all down, but, as Dan pointed out, I know he's not taking 10s of millions from foreign nations like the Clintons and I know he hasn't sold out to the Chinese.
We're facing a deeply serious foreign threat in China, who is attacking us on every front including internally. There is absolutely no reason to think Biden will take that threat seriously or do anything about it, and a number of reasons to think he will completely capitulate.
And they're stunningly insidious. They are even funding groups to approach state level governments, local governments, city councils. It sounds insane, and it is, but they are still doing it.Quote:
Originally Posted by KeithKSR
They're deeply involved in spying in every area of technology and research in this country, but we now know they are funding BLM projects, etc.
By loose cannon I’m referring to him tweeting major decisions before he tells his staff and then everyone clamoring to cover the situation, or quitting because they can’t justify such a decision. And these seem like high ranking well respected individuals that he personally chose because they were such, over and over again. I guess that’s what I don’t understand.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc
It's very much his style.Quote:
Originally Posted by Padukacat
I'm not endorsing it, but some managers do like a very competitive style. It's not my style, but it can be effective.
IMO a LOT of what is in the books are from people in the administration who lost on their position. Trump has had a number of neo-cons in the foreign policy area, and he's not a neo-con. So he goes a different direction and they use the media, both before and after the decision, to try to sway things.
That's a tried and true Washington practice.
It doesn't mean Trump isn't impulsive, and often ignores his staff, but I think that has to be tempered somewhat in that everyone in Washington has an agenda.
I get that the style is not washington, it's "The Apprentice", but in the end in 4 years he has yet to take a policy position that is truly damaging, or anything out of bounds of what you would get in a lot of normal processes.
And I think a lot of his excess is intentional. Much as Reagan created an aura of a man who was willing to go much father in US response, playing the Cowboy, I think Trump's use of the "madman" in foreign policy can be effective.
It pays to have your enemies worry about you.
Now, i think Trump is that way whether it's wise or not, I don't think he can help it, but the net effect hasn't been negative IMO, even if it is disturbing.
I'd never work for the guy, it must be ugly in there every day, but he clearly likes it that way and wants it that way. After 4 years of predicting WWIII we're actually fine and in some ways better. Hard to believe, but so far so good, as long as you aren't working there, lol.
Makes sense I suppose. So explain to me the negatives about Biden and voting democrat. Do we really think he will make our country socialist? That seems to be an overreaction assuming we won’t turn around and vote the other way in four years which I think would happen. Is he really senile or is it a result of a childhood stutter and being older? I don’t really think his son funneling money is a big deal considering that’s why almost everyone goes to Washington and I’d be disappoint if trump wasnt benefitting more greatly than anyone in dirty ways. Do we think the dems will reform police to the point we lose control really? Honestly my biggest worry with them has always been that we would be owned by China and others in short order if we let them run the show, and trumps trade policy has been one of the few things I really have loved that he has done. I’ve made more money with trump I suppose but don’t think I’m benefitting from taxes that’s seems to be business owners and large corp? I really hate the fake racism call that’s out there, but then I see some awful things happening and question whether things are worse maybe because trump is inciting it with his talk or lack of compassion. He obviously doesn’t care much for black folks, regardless of what he’s done for them or not. All of this said it’s all just one persons observation and I’m the guy that they talk about who is in the middle and not real certain how to vote I suppose. I’m a conservative guy I suppose, I don’t like the liberal agenda, and I also think trump is awful for our country as a whole. I hate the idea of voting on fear of what the other party may do, whether it’s trump and his crazy or joe and his socialism. I did feel certain Hillary was going to take us down a path with no return, maybe I’m hear to see if you can convince me joe or dems will do the same this time.Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenBBN
Just a small suggestion go listen to Candice Owens and she will tell you that the Democrats are the truly racist ones and that trump has done more for the blacks.
She has a great pod cast.
I honestly do think that the Democrats will drive towards a socialist government as they like the control it gives them over the mindless.
Health care for everyone? Who will fund that? Means higher taxes.
Portland, chicago, Seattle what do they have in common? Major riots and run by Democrats.
Minneapolis run by Democrats have already started to defund the police.
Do some research on Omar who is a Democrat who married her brother to keep him in the US.
Opening the boarders back up allowing anyone to come on in the US that is very taxing and overpopulating. Who pays for them we do with higher taxes.
Harris has stated she will force the gun buy back program which is really Democrats forcing Americans to give up their weapons.
She has also stated there will be health care for everyone, meaning higher taxes.
If you have concerns over China, then you don’t want Biden near the White House. China now owns Biden and his family, and will leverage their financial interest in the Bidens.Quote:
Originally Posted by Padukacat
Biden is a puppet for the far left. That was the trade off in getting the extremists to suddenly bow out of the race. Bernie and AOC are touting what they will do if the get Biden elected.
It’s not just Candace Owens. Leo Terrell flipped to the GOP over racism on the left. Gianno Caldwell Now touts the GOP as actually helping blacks, while the Dems take them for granted. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9cCYRUaSH8Quote:
Originally Posted by catmanjack
I suppose the real tally on the "thoughts on the debate" are America's to make. Rasmussen (the very friendly Trump poll) has Biden +12 now. In this same poll, he has gone from +1 to +8 to +12. And the +12 includes his Covid/hospital/leaving debacle. I don't think any of us think Biden is going to win by +12 but Trump's numbers are simply sinking right now. And everything he is doing is making it worse. His numbers started falling with the Supreme Court situation and have gotten worse daily since.
P.S. These numbers do not include yesterday's "pulling out of negotiations on the Covid bill" (and an immediate Stock Market dive).
https://www.rasmussenreports.com/pub...se_watch_oct07
This issue with the covid relief bill is what have the Democrats throw in the 2.4 trillion and where will that money come from.
How is it actually broken down? I think knowing that would shock everyone.
The rich...who apparently do not pay their fair share.Quote:
Originally Posted by catmanjack
Biden claims only those making over $400,000 would see a tax increase, yet he is on record saying day 1 he will get rid of Trump's tax cuts. See the left does not see removing tax cuts as increasing taxes. Trumps tax cuts reduced the taxes, including those under $400K. But the semantics is, the word game played is that he isn't "raising taxes"....just removing the tax cuts.
Democrats love to point to the increasing debt yet want to spend, spend, spend. Not any different that the GOP did under Obama. Both sides need to QUIT SPENDING OTHER PEOPLES MONEY because its NOT THEIR money to spend.
Investors got over the “yesterday’s pulling out of negotiations” pretty quickly. Market rallied today Dow+ 530, S&P +58
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Yeah, that stuff is totally ephemeral. Means nothing in the long run to investing.Quote:
Originally Posted by blueboss
Except if Biden would happen to pull this off, in which case we’ll see a steady decline. Goodbye401, goodbye IRA, goodbye early retirement.Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenBBN
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I honestly believe the Young Democrats would believe anything you tell them they are so mindless and lacking common sense in a major way!
The True great America is slowing being destroyed by the Democrats.
It’s really sad!
During his daily Covid briefings, Andy was begging the Washington crowd to get on with passage of the bill that will save Kentuckians. He is avoiding saying that the passage needs to be Pelosi's version so it will put money into KY's depleted bank account. He attacked the Senate yesterday for not being part of the negations, but he stayed away from mentioning Mitch in his comments. He is aware of where the real power in KY's government comes from.
Beshear is an idiot, and likely a one term idiot. Kentucky would be unlikely to get any funds from the Pelosi slush fund. Kentucky ranks 23rd in state debt, there are cities with more debt than our state has. With a single statewide office being held by a Democrat it is even more unlikely Pelosi would earmark funds for this state.Quote:
Originally Posted by dan_bgblue
Why don’t they break down where these funds will go?