Not sure if I should be confused, irritated or pissed

[Doc]

but leaning towards pissed.......


Typical "off" day at work which means I go in for stuff. So get there at 8:30 and the staff (1 receptionist, 2 technicians and 1 associate Dr) are in the pharmacy having their morning gaggle. They are discussing the "stimulus checks" they got yesterday. Now pay attention, this is AT WORK and among EMPLOYEES who are presently working and getting a paycheck. In fact I am scrambling to do things to keep them employed, and the government is sending them checks?!?. I was under the impression this $2,000,000,000,000 package was so that those out of work could make their mortgage payments, etc.... Hence the source of my "confusion". So when did it be become yet another plain old give people money program? The next time I hear about "tax cuts for the rich" I am going to tell the a-hole who says it to shove a stick up their ass because this is coming out of my tax paying ass. These employee's getting checks typically are not paying federal income taxes, something I do....and if they do pay some marginal tax, they just got it ALL back plus some. Now keep in mind, I'm all for helping those who are actually out of work due to this epidemic but I'm not for giving money away to those who are working. Hence my irritated or pissed status. Hell, even the associate Dr is expecting a check today because I guess she falls under the household minimum to be able to grab onto the government teat

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Suckling_piglets.jpg/1200px-Suckling_piglets.jpg

This isn't helping them "pay the mortgage" or "pay for groceries". Its just another of what government does best, take from one group (the rich) and give it to everybody else, disguised as something else.

This is the reason I felt all the money should go to business (small and large) to PAY EMPLOYEES who were NOT WORKING. And if the business paid over a certain amount of that "loan" (ie 80%) as salary to nonexecutive employees, then the loan would be forgiven. Instead our legislature had to carve out its vig for their pet projects, vilify the business, and pay the paupers. Oh, then vote themselves a raise.

That said, I don't blame the employee. They just opened the mail. It is the governments ineptness and downright deceptiveness that yanks my crank. To quote Rham Emmanuel who quoted Winston Churchill...... "NEVER LET A SERIOUS (GOOD) CRISIS GO TO WASTE"

[CitizenBBN]

Oh, the whole thing is a joke. It will keep money priming the economic pump so that's good, but the fairness of it is insulting.

thanks to the Dems holding up the extra PPP funding I doubt I get a penny out of this, while all my employees go on reduced hours and get a raise. I still have to pay all the mortgages, utilities, insurance, etc. without any help in all liklihood. Even if PPP money comes through it's tied to payroll in such a way that it really won't cover or will barely cover part of those expenses, nowhere near all of them.

Meanwhile everyone who even QUITS a job gets enough to pay all their bills and then some, at least for 95% of people. 600x4 = $2,400 plus their unemployment which will run 30-60% of salary in most states for anyone in say a $60-70K job or lower.

Yeah, really fair deal.

yes, ideally all of the money needed to come to businesses to cover payroll and other expenses IF they didn't let people go. Employees would still get their pay to stay home, but they wouldn't get a raise to stay home, and businesses could actually pay rent and insurance and such and survive.

But this country is dead when it comes to the vision of our Founders. People say we should be more like democratically socialist Europe. As far as I can tell we're already there, and now just quibbling over differences no different than how Scandinavia may do it versus how France does it.

[CitizenBBN]

BTW, I vote we go for "depressed". Its sad to see such a Great Experiment end. All things must end, all empires crumble, but 250 years seems too short for individual liberty to shine in just one part of the world.

[ukpumacat]

Ha. A Republican President and a Republican Senate but somehow it’s the Dems fault.
Trump signed this. Blame your guy if you don’t like it. ;)

[ukpumacat]

FWIW, I’m not a fan. I won’t get a dime either.
I can think of all kinds of problems.
The least of which is they base it on income from last year. Which isn’t helpful for people who just lost their $150K a year job.
And I’m not sure how much $1200 helps for 2-3 months but I suppose it’s better than nothing.

[Doc]

Ha. A Republican President and a Republican Senate but somehow it’s the Dems fault.
Trump signed this. Blame your guy if you don’t like it. ;)

Where did I or anybody blame the democrats.

I blame the entire system...all of them, including the voters who repeated re-elect the same jackasses

[ukpumacat]

Where did I or anybody blame the democrats.

I blame the entire system...all of them, including the voters who repeated re-elect the same jackasses

Not you.

“ thanks to the Dems holding up the extra PPP funding I doubt I get a penny out of this, while all my employees go on reduced hours and get a raise.”

[CitizenBBN]

Ha. A Republican President and a Republican Senate but somehow it’s the Dems fault.
Trump signed this. Blame your guy if you don’t like it. ;)

I blamed them all. I only blamed the Dems for holding up the extra funds when it became obvious the small amount of PPP money was going to run dry in days.

I blame Trump and the GOP and the Dems and everyone else who lives in DC that is part of this machine of stupidity.

The whole approach is wrong. But it's been wrong for decades upon decades. I blame them all, and #1 on my list is LBJ, arguably the worst President and human being to ever hold the office.

Now, reality also says you'd have to march Democrats in at gunpoint to vote for the plan Doc and I outlined, while with the GOP you might only have to use a knife. But they are all at fault.

Which is why I liked Perot, why I wished Trump could do more draining of the swamp, and why I support anyone who wants to remove the elites and the trimumverate of big corporations, big government and big labor from power.

[CitizenBBN]

Not you.

“ thanks to the Dems holding up the extra PPP funding I doubt I get a penny out of this, while all my employees go on reduced hours and get a raise.”

I blamed them for holding up the extra money. No where did I blame them for the overall horrid structure of the bailout.

And just to be clear, the extra $250 billion is also a drop in the bucket. Even that won't cover the current applications in the pool, not even close. And that goes to the bureaucrats all doing this math and not having a clue how much small business there really is in the country apparently.

But it was an easy yes vote based on what is happening. And I'd hold the GOP to it too.

My team isn't Trump or the GOP. My team are those names on the Declaration of Independence. I ask myself what would they do when it comes to policy, and go from there. The fact that Trump is currently closer to their vision than the Democrats is why I defend him, that and the fact that he elicits such over reactions it distorts good policy decisions. And I've said many times he does that on purpose b/c he loves trolling, so it's not like he has no fault in that problem.

[CitizenBBN]

since I extended it on the other board, extending a virtual hug and beer on this one too. This is a crisis of epic proportions, maybe we need to remember we're all on the same side. :)

Some of you are just confused. I'm here to help. :tongue08:

[Basket Case]

I thought this at the time and thought that over time it would prove true, that if the bill is something Trump, Pelosi, Shumer and McConnell agree on - its probably a turd.

Maybe Massie was right?

[ukpumacat]

The hope I guess is that it helps some even if not perfect. That’s fine.

And yes, things suck right now. I said my peace about Trump early on. I just disagreed as it was happening.
He’s been Trumpian since but he’s listened to the experts and I’m good with that.

[CitizenBBN]

He's very "Trumpian". lol. Love him or hate him he's definitely his own brand.

I see some Teddy Roosevelt in his behavior at times, the difference being that TR is arguably one of the most he-man men in American history and earned his moxy and attitude and ego.

And I fully supported passing the bills, knowing the approach was all wrong, b/c I also know that's the best we're going to do with the current political landscape.

But it's all ass-backwards. To help people we need jobs and education. if the government would focus on those two things everything else would fall in line. If they had put the money through businesses you'd have all the right incentives and the money would still get to the employees.

[CitizenBBN]

I thought this at the time and thought that over time it would prove true, that if the bill is something Trump, Pelosi, Shumer and McConnell agree on - its probably a turd.

Maybe Massie was right?

Massie is right - and wrong.

No doubt Congress bends the rules to the point of breaking, most notably by delegating most of the laws to the bureaucracy.

But when the enemy is coming over the hill you just have to get the ammo to the troops and not worry too much about the requisition forms. Even the Constitution sometimes has to stand aside for a true crisis, and absolutely no one believes more in the Constitution than I do.

[MickintheHam]

As an aside, I was having trouble getting to my mobile banking account today. Finally, the bank put up a banner saying they were temporarily down. Later in the afternoon, I was texting with one of my UK buddies at the bank. He said they were down and then told me 3 other national banks that were down. The consensus of the bank employees was it was people looking to see if their government checks were deposited that brought the system down.

[MickintheHam]

It’s now been revealed a woman in Florida had $8.5M deposited in her account yesterday. OOPS!

[KeithKSR]

People who received refunds, which means a lot of people who get EIC and received huge checks in February and March, have already gotten their stimulus checks. I will get a delayed paper check because I had to pay the IRS instead of not getting a refund. My elderly fixed income parents on Soc Sec will have to wait on theirs as well.

[GhettoBird]

Do you guys think they will get the Paycheck Protection Program more funding?

[MickintheHam]

The hope I guess is that it helps some even if not perfect. That’s fine.

And yes, things suck right now. I said my peace about Trump early on. I just disagreed as it was happening.
He’s been Trumpian since but he’s listened to the experts and I’m good with that.

Effective listening is the least understood skillset of Trump. He is a great listener. Dr. Fauci has said that about both Trump and Pence. I’m not getting a payment either, but I’m good with that. Restoring the economy will have a far bigger impact on me than $1200 would.

[CitizenBBN]

Do you guys think they will get the Paycheck Protection Program more funding?

Eventually it will get another nibble, $250 or $350 billion. But it will take another big package with the Dems rolling in far larger sums for lots of unrelated things and even larger sums for direct welfare payments of one kind or another.

[Doc]

It’s now been revealed a woman in Florida had $8.5M deposited in her account yesterday. OOPS!

That was Shawn



this post originated in the Caymen Islands

[Doc]

People who received refunds, which means a lot of people who get EIC and received huge checks in February and March, have already gotten their stimulus checks. I will get a delayed paper check because I had to pay the IRS instead of not getting a refund. My elderly fixed income parents on Soc Sec will have to wait on theirs as well.

So my natural question is why would somebody on S.S., who I assume is retired hence not working, be getting an additional check? I thought the idea was to help those out of work or in places were work has slowed and people are not making as much money. Paying to retired people on S.S. makes no sense since their income has not changed.

[Doc]

Do you guys think they will get the Paycheck Protection Program more funding?

Not if ANY of the money is going to people who are working, retirees on Social Security, welfare recips, those who were already on unemployement or illegals.

[Doc]

Effective listening is the least understood skillset of Trump. He is a great listener. Dr. Fauci has said that about both Trump and Pence. I’m not getting a payment either, but I’m good with that. Restoring the economy will have a far bigger impact on me than $1200 would.

Me as well. Never expected a handout from the gov't because I am working. Returning the economy is FAR better. My investments are down well into 6 figures. Fortunately at 56 years of age, it has plenty of time to recover. But to be honest, my portfolio is currently as just above what I started with when I sold my practice and invested the money 4 years ago. It did nothing for the first year, then ballooned the last 3. All those gains gone but they are gains, and the base funds still there, plus more shares means it will grow quicker assuming we don't elect somebody who will kill the economy.

[MickintheHam]

Me as well. Never expected a handout from the gov't because I am working. Returning the economy is FAR better. My investments are down well into 6 figures. Fortunately at 56 years of age, it has plenty of time to recover. But to be honest, my portfolio is currently as just above what I started with when I sold my practice and invested the money 4 years ago. It did nothing for the first year, then ballooned the last 3. All those gains gone but they are gains, and the base funds still there, plus more shares means it will grow quicker assuming we don't elect somebody who will kill the economy.

you are exactly correct. I'm still up going back to the 2016 election. This president knew what was wrong with this economy and went about fixing it with unprecedented urgency. In 3 years he has undone the damage Congress, the bureaucrats and McKinsey have done to the economy and the American worker.

[Terminus]

Do you guys think they will get the Paycheck Protection Program more funding?

I got an email this morning that said funds for the PPP had been exhausted, but that funds had been reserved for our firm. The local bank followed that up this afternoon with a loan number so they must be planning on providing additional capital soon.

[Doc]

So now I learn today that my son isn't eligible for a check. This is a kid who goes to school full time plus works for the school for 10-20 hrs a week. Now he has no paycheck at all. Nothing. Plus his room mate is in the same boat. Josh, the roommate, has to pay rent (to me since I own the condo they live in) but since Josh has no income AND no gov't bailout, he is SOL. Which is why when he went to pay rent in early April I told him to keep it and buy groceries instead. Meanwhile my daughter and her husband bot got checks despite being employed, working and getting all the overtime they want. He is a police officer and she is a dispatcher. No loss of income, no reduction in pay, etc.... yet they got their checks.

If you want something done wrong, get the government involved!!!

[CitizenBBN]

Good article to back you up Doc. I argued against the idea that < 500 employees is "small". IMO less than 50 is small, MAYBE 100 (the threshold for many federal regs). 500 is a way for the Swamp (both Administration and Congress) to reward much larger and better connected businesses.

The limit was $10 million per business? TEN F'ING MILLION? SERIOUSLY? that's "small"? for what was budgeted to be about a 2-3 month period?

Now that could help some smaller manufacturing, etc. but it will scoop up a lot of businesses that aren't nearly so bad off.

Anyway, nice article on where that money is going:

https://www.foxbusiness.com/money/stimulus-intended-to-help-coronavirus-ravaged-small-businesses-instead-rewarding-hedge-funds-brokerages


I got notice my loan is being processed, but since they're out of money I may not get a penny. Esp. if Pelosi and Schumer won't support it unless we add in a bunch of crap like airline emissions restrictions or maybe more money for Big Bird to feather his nest.

I'm thinking of asking if I can get a check if I promise to buy season tickets to the Kennedy Center.

[CitizenBBN]

Senate has adjourned without the small business funding, and Pelosi/Schumer have no intention of doing it without it being part of another big spending lunacy.

Yeah, but they care about the little guy. Sure they do. Independent contractors had to wait even longer to apply, so those guys are even farther behind.

Glad they fought for the Kennedy Center and the Arts though. Will give us something to watch while we're sitting at home looking for jobs.