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ColonelSteve
10-14-2012, 12:05 PM
By now it's obvious Joker's tenure is coming to an end, fans arent showing up anymore, theyre strongly voicing their displeasure to the point where callers to the coach's call in show is being screened, even Rich Brooks has voiced his displeasure on Twitter. So now it becomes, not if Joker is fired, but when, and honestly, two other SEC teams will be looking for a new coach for sure, Arkansas and Tennessee, the more time passes, the more it's looking like Auburn will be joining that group as well, and who knows what else will happen the rest of the season, Mullen could possibly be looking for a better job if Nebraska decides they want a change, Richt could want to escape the impatient Georgia fanbase, Mizzou could decide Pinkle isnt an SEC caliber coach, the point is we could be looking at a year where more SEC coaches are gonna be replaced than in recent memory, and if Kentucky doesnt act and act fast, we could end up being declined by coaches we could probably get a year ago. Rumors have been swirling this week about Kentuckys possible interest in David Cutcliffe, but lets be honest, if he is sitting at home debating whether to stay at Duke, go to Kentucky or go to Tennessee, he's gonna pick Tennessee 10 times out of 10, that's just the cold hard truth. So who can we realistically get? Let's look at the possibilities.

Willie Taggart- Western Kentucky
Career Record - 14-16 3rd season
Pros: Took a team that was on a 20 game winning streak and is two wins away from back to back winning seasons in the Sun Belt. In 2011, had Bobby Rainey which was 5th in the entire FBS level in rushing yards with 1695 yards, averaging 4.6 YPC and 13 TDs, as a team they were 43rd in rushing with 181.6 YPG. In 2012 without Rainey, they have actually improved to 196.2 YPG, 33rd in the FBS, WHICH PROVES that Taggart can replace star players. This year WKU averages 30 PPG which is 56th in FBS and allows 22.0 PPG, 38th best.

Cons: WKU is 1-4 against the SEC under Taggart with an combined score of 185-72 and an average margin of defeat of 28.5 points, but again, those scores are against UK, Alabama and LSU and it is WKU, does that really mean as much? And just because he can win in the Sun Belt, does that mean he can win in the SEC, well considering the amount of upsets the Sun Belt has pulled on BCS schools this year, it possibly means more than we can imagine.

The truth is Taggart is THE young coach who relates to his players that Kentucky needs, on the flip side, everyone thinks the same way, and Taggart is THE hot coach of this year, if WKU wins out, he can get any job he wants.

David Cutcliffe- Duke
Career Record 64-64, 20-35 at Duke
Duke averages 291.3 passing YPG which is 25th in FBS, 111.1 rushing YPG, 108th in FBS, 35.3 PPG (34th) and allows 27.4 PPG (72nd)

Pros: Won a NC as an OC at Tennessee in 1998 with a QB that replaced Peyton Manning, again showing he can replace star players. Has built Duke into a respectable program and to date has a 5-2 record, with one more win Duke will have the most wins since the 1994 season where they went 8-4. He became only the 2nd Ole Miss coach to have 5 straight winning season to begin his tenure, something even Johnny Vaught couldnt do.He finished with a 44-29 record and was fired after refusing to fire some assistants following a 4-7 season, his only losing season in Oxford. Probably the biggest pro in all of this, Cutcliffe has recruiting ties in at least NC, TN, AL, LA and MS, something Kentucky desperately needs to compete on a hire level.

Cons: Only once did Ole Miss finish with a record above .500 in the SEC, a 7-1 record in 2003, losing only to eventual National Champions LSU, his record in the SEC is only 25-23 with 2 seasons below .500. This is an option where Kentucky fans really need to do some soul searching and decide if we want to go back to just the Rich Brooks years, or if we want to go where Rich Brooks was building to, and if that's the case, then Cutcliffe might not be the man for the job, if youre content with the Music City Bowl, the Independence Bowl just because it's better than where we are now, then by all means Cutcliffe is the right man for the job, but like stated earlier, Tennessee will also be looking for a new coach this offseason because Dooley is not working out, if Tennessee offers Cutcliffe, Cutcliffe will take that job without thinking twice.

On a side note: all we've heard this last couple weeks was that every UK opponent we've played up until the Arkansas game has had only 2 losses, and Kent States loss to Kentucky was one of them, while Duke has a 5-2 record, those 5 wins comes with a combined record of 11-21 and the best record of those teams belongs to North Carolina Central which has a 4-2 record, add the wins together and the total record is 19-26

Mike Leach- Washington State
Career record 86-47, 2-4 at Washington State
Stats: 322.3 Passing YPG (12th) 40.6 Rushing YPG (112th), 21.1 PPG (103rd), 30.4 Points APG (86th)

Pros: We've seen what he did at Kentucky under Mumme, the 802 yards against Louisville in 98 was an NCAA record for 14 years until West Virginia broke the record earlier this year against Baylor. In 5 of his 10 seasons in Lubbock, TT finished above .500 in the Big 12 and finished 3rd or higher in the South 7 of those years and is Techs all time winningest coach. The following is the notable achievements from Wikipedia

Kentucky

Four NCAA, 42 SEC, and 116 school records broken as Kentucky's offensive coordinator[70]

Texas Tech

10 consecutive winning seasons
8 consecutive seasons with at least 8 wins
4 seasons with at least 9 wins[71]
1 season with 11 wins
9 consecutive bowl appearances[72]
5 bowl wins (most by any individual coach in the history of the program)[72]
4 seasons completed with team ranked in the Top 25[73]
19–11 record against in-state conference rivals Baylor, Texas, and Texas A&M
53–11 record at Jones AT&T Stadium, home of the Texas Tech Red Raider football team
2008 AP Big 12 Coach of the Year[31]
2008 Big 12 Coach of the Year[32]
Coached 1 Fred Biletnikoff Award (Best Wide Receiver) winner: Michael Crabtree (two-time winner)
Coached 1 Johnny Unitas Golden Arm Award (Best Senior Quarterback) winner: Graham Harrell
Coached 1 Mosi Tatupu Award (Best Kick Returner) winner: Wes Welker
Coached 3 Sammy Baugh Trophy (Outstanding Quarterback) winners: Kliff Kingsbury, B.J. Symons, and Graham Harrell
More than 150 NCAA, Big 12 and school records broken as Texas Tech's head coach[7]

Cons: He, like Mumme, is WAY too one dimensional, we saw with Mumme, Kentucky seriously competed in the SEC only to get slowly and slowly worse after Couch left, this is the SEC, SEC coaches catch on quick and if you dont have a solid running game, if you dont have a defense to help you out, you are NOT gonna be in a position to win games, plain and simple. Also he has a Billy Gillispie-esq reputation, whether or not the whole tool shed incident is true, we saw that Tech was looking for a reason to fire him because they just did not like his personality. While he is better than Gillispie, it is proven that he has a reputation, the question is begged to be ask, is this a hire that Kentucky will pay for later on? He's already complaining about his Washington State team and there could be some trouble down the line.

Tommy Tuberville
Career Record 126-73, 18-13 at Texas Tech
2012 stats: 369.0 Passing YPG (4th), 168.3 Rushing YPG (60th), 40.7 PPG (16th), 16.3 PAG(17th)

Pros: Not only has he won in the SEC, he has dominated in the SEC, in 14 seasons with Ole Miss and Auburn, only 6 were below .500 in the conference, in 5 seasons Auburn either tied for 1st in or outright won the West with a combined SEC record of 64-50 before resigning against the ADs wishes in 2008.

Cons: His record at Auburn was much different than at Ole Miss going 52-30 at Auburn, and 12-20 at Ole Miss. It's well documented that Kentucky has the lowest budget in the SEC, but Auburn puts a lot more into the program than Ole Miss, could that be a sign of things to come if he came to UK, after Tech beat Oklahoma last year, they completely hit rock bottom to finish the year going 0-5, however, is that a factor that would keep Kentucky from hiring him...god I hope not cause in this case (and in others), the cons just dont outweigh the pros, if Kentucky hired TT, it would send shock waves throughout the south.


Who else could we get, I mean REALLY get, Jon Gruden isnt coming to Lexington, neither is Andy Reid, Mike Tomlim or Marvin Lewis...REALISTICALLY, who would get you excited about Kentucky football again, either on this list or not

ColonelSteve
10-14-2012, 12:17 PM
737

dan_bgblue
10-14-2012, 01:10 PM
When there is an opening I think we will hear at least 10=15 names thrown around. I notice you did not mention Petrino. Several fans have their hearts set on him.

ColonelSteve
10-14-2012, 01:17 PM
When there is an opening I think we will hear at least 10=15 names thrown around. I notice you did not mention Petrino. Several fans have their hearts set on him.

And I dont understand why, yeah he did great at Louisville and Arkansas but, he's not gonna stay long and has NEVER left a program better when he left than when he came, is it worth it to have two great years just to be back where were at right now when he decides to jump ship because he's back to being greedy or because he makes another PR mistake? He is NOT gonna be here a long time if he comes, that is the cold hard truth.

SalsaKat
10-14-2012, 01:56 PM
Don't forget Sonny Dykes at La Tech.

Pros: (See: Leach, Mike)
Cons: (See: Leach, Mike)

Catfan73
10-14-2012, 03:19 PM
I don't think the guy who's going to be our next coach has even hit your radar yet Col.

Dogsoldier202
10-14-2012, 06:17 PM
As far as Petrino goes it depends on what other jobs are open. If UT is open and they offer to petrino well he will end up going to UT before UK. To be honest with you I love Willie Taggerts style of football, it comes from the Hardbaugh camp, tough in your face run style offense. If you look at the 4 best teams in the SEC this year what do all of them have in common? Running the ball and Defense. I really like what Taggert has done with WKU.

In the end it dosent matter who the Coach is if the University dosent throw some support behind the program.

I just read in the Sept 17 issue of ESPN the magazine that out of the 120 top programs in FBS UK ranked 23rd in football revenue..I will have to go dig that issue out to show how many SEC we are ahead of in revenue, I know that we rank ahead of:



USC(southern Cal) 26th

FSU -21st

Miami- 35th

Clemson-25th

Oregon- 32nd

Stanford- 57th

WVU- 55th

Mizzou- 39th

BSU- 72nd

Ole Miss- 28th

Louisville- 37th

Miss State- 46th

Vandy- 48th

Cincy- 70th

KSU is 56th



That is how some schools rank



South Carolina is 15th, UT is 13th, Arkansas is 10th, Bama is 2nd, LSU is 9th, UF is 5th, UGA is 4th and Auburn is 3rd

Darrell KSR
10-14-2012, 07:37 PM
Leach is struggling at Washington State. Basically the same team UK is (different way, but similar results. Sagarin has them within 0.3 points of each other).

Doesn't mean he's not a good coach, or wouldn't do well here. Don't think this is the year to get him, though.

I wasn't a fan of Sonny Dykes, but he grew on me while watching the game last night. What could he do with better talent?

Willie Taggert is doing a good job. But do we take a flyer on a guy just because he is at a mid-major and seems to be overperforming in the short term?

I think the guy UK needs is a guy with NFL experience. I don't know who that is. Doesn't have to be a NFL head coach. Just somebody that knows how they do it there, has contacts there, understands the business of football.

SalsaKat
10-14-2012, 08:49 PM
I think Taggart is a pipe dream. He's a "Western guy" and right now that's a better job. Pains me to say it but true. He may leave his alma mater for a better job someday but Kentucky ain't it.

Darrell KSR
10-15-2012, 01:11 PM
I think Taggart is a pipe dream. He's a "Western guy" and right now that's a better job. Pains me to say it but true. He may leave his alma mater for a better job someday but Kentucky ain't it.

112 Willie Taggart W. Kentucky 36 Sun Belt $450,000

vs

44 Joker Phillips Kentucky 48 SEC $1,850,000

I'm a Sun Belt alumnus, but I would be shocked if Willie Taggart wouldn't crawl over broken glass to Lexington. Of course, if he has other offers, that statement doesn't apply. But being good in the Sun Belt is not a better job than being bad in the Southeastern Conference. The money alone is 1/4th what it is at Kentucky. And there's a HUGE difference in $450k and $1.85 million as far as a family is concerned.

VirginiaCat
10-15-2012, 01:30 PM
Do you guys mind if I dream about a Tony Dungy or a Bill Cowher???

I would take Petrino in a heartbeat (cannot believe I just typed that) as long as you locked him tight for 6 years. I mean tight. Penal tight....

Has to cost him and his next job way too much to steal him...

BigBlueJoe
10-15-2012, 01:59 PM
And I dont understand why, yeah he did great at Louisville and Arkansas but, he's not gonna stay long and has NEVER left a program better when he left than when he came, is it worth it to have two great years just to be back where were at right now when he decides to jump ship because he's back to being greedy or because he makes another PR mistake? He is NOT gonna be here a long time if he comes, that is the cold hard truth.

I don't think he would jump ship. He seemed like he was going to be at Arkansas until he retired and then he had that really bad, unethical move on his part with the affair. I just don't see how he could possibly make another mistake like that or just up and leave with how he did at UL, or the Falcons. He may not have any options even if he happened to win at UK because of his actions at the other schools. Obviously there is still the chance that he leaves but I don't think it's as clear cut as many people believe. Also what if he is only here for 2-3 years... That's 2-3 years that are going to be much better as far as winning% goes. If he leaves after that amount of time then we could be in this situation but how could we go lower than we are now? At least another coach would take over with talent and experience left behind by Petrino.

Darrell KSR
10-16-2012, 09:33 AM
Do you guys mind if I dream about a Tony Dungy or a Bill Cowher???

I would take Petrino in a heartbeat (cannot believe I just typed that) as long as you locked him tight for 6 years. I mean tight. Penal tight....

Has to cost him and his next job way too much to steal him...

You know, I don't ask my doctor what he does in his private life, as long as he takes care of me. I'd say the same about Bobby Petrino--again, with your caveat duly noted.

There has to be someone out there that can right the ship.

SalsaKat
10-16-2012, 11:02 AM
112 Willie Taggart W. Kentucky 36 Sun Belt $450,000

vs

44 Joker Phillips Kentucky 48 SEC $1,850,000

I'm a Sun Belt alumnus, but I would be shocked if Willie Taggart wouldn't crawl over broken glass to Lexington. Of course, if he has other offers, that statement doesn't apply. But being good in the Sun Belt is not a better job than being bad in the Southeastern Conference. The money alone is 1/4th what it is at Kentucky. And there's a HUGE difference in $450k and $1.85 million as far as a family is concerned.

Respectfully disagree. We're in a place were the major boosters only care about basketball (there's a reason football doesn't have it's own Joe Craft Center) and we play in the toughest conference in the NFL, er, NCAA. You're playing a Vegas craps table with dice that have a 1 on five sides. Betting black on a high-stakes roulette wheel that has 34 reds. It's not impossible to win here, and doing so at a high level *might* get the fatcats to change the memo lines of their checks, but there's no denying that you have nearly every disadvantage weighing on the coach here. The money would be better but from where I'm standing it seems like a coach would look at this job and decide that he just wouldn't have a chance to be successful here and he'd be unhappy. I mean after all, SEC, ACC, and PAC-10 champion coaches haven't been able to win 8 games here. Besides, if money were the end-all Calipari would have stayed at Memphis. He'd probably be wise to wait for a similar offer at a better place to succeed, develop his career, and ultimately enjoy his job which is important.

Now normally I would agree that a Sun Belt coach would be willing to overlook a lot to coach in the SEC but I think with Western being his alma mater it might take something special to get him to want to leave. Could be wrong, but...

I love this team, I really do. I love all UK programs but football is my baby. And it hurts me to see it in the place it's in, not just losing but forgotten and left to die. But to any future UK coaches I think all I could say is, may God have mercy on your soul.

Darrell KSR
10-16-2012, 11:25 AM
New name:

Cincinnati football coach Butch Jones.

I don't have all of his qualifications in front of me, but in 3 years at Central Michigan as head coach, finished 1st twice and 2nd once, going to 3 bowl games. At UC, first year 4-8 inheriting a mess, 2nd year won 10 games/finished T1 in Big East, and this year is undefeated.

UK won't pull the trigger early enough, but this is a guy that probably would move and embrace the opportunity.

Badinage
10-16-2012, 12:27 PM
Okay, I have heard Jones discussed as a possible UK coach. I have to ask why would he leave UC for UK?

And, do you think he is a candidate for a better job?

Catfan73
10-16-2012, 01:36 PM
Why wouldn't he?

And he's undoubtedly on the short list for lots of jobs, but if you're going to try to read the minds of these guys on where they might like to test their coaching skills, you're going to have an awfully short list.

Darrell KSR
10-16-2012, 01:52 PM
Okay, I have heard Jones discussed as a possible UK coach. I have to ask why would he leave UC for UK?

And, do you think he is a candidate for a better job?

I think he'd be smart to wait for a better job. But if he isn't already on the short list for another, there are a lot of reasons to leave Cincinnati. Big East is a dying conference.

For Kentucky to get a guy like that--who is making the same $1.85 million that Joker Phillips is making--I think we'd have to double the salary to $3.7 million.

Mitch purportedly has said that UK could pay $4 million. That's enough to get a good coach, if Kentucky will really do it.

Badinage
10-16-2012, 02:48 PM
I think some coaches would consider a move from Cincy to UK to be, at best, a lateral move. I suspect Cincy would pay Jones more, especially if his season ends as well as it started. Regardless, I think Jones will have opportunities better than the Cats will be offering. UK may look to him like a pay day, but a place to bury your dead career. Given its history with coaches, finding a coach at the end of his career or someone who has been out of coaching for a while is probably the easiest get for UK.

I could see coaching friends saying "kiss your HC career goodbye at UK, you will be coaching a position someplace in 4 or so years."

Catfan73
10-16-2012, 03:26 PM
I think some coaches would consider a move from Cincy to UK to be, at best, a lateral move. I suspect Cincy would pay Jones more, especially if his season ends as well as it started. Regardless, I think Jones will have opportunities better than the Cats will be offering. UK may look to him like a pay day, but a place to bury your dead career. Given its history with coaches, finding a coach at the end of his career or someone who has been out of coaching for a while is probably the easiest get for UK.

I could see coaching friends saying "kiss your HC career goodbye at UK, you will be coaching a position someplace in 4 or so years."

You're starting to sound like one of those OTIS fans now Bad, the ones that like to try to get a little dig in at UK as some sort of coaching graveyard. But is it any more true at UK than at anyplace else? Going only back to Curci:

Fran Curci -- eventually fired after probation, but had more success at UK than anyone since Bear Bryant.
Jerry Claiborne -- retired from coaching.
Bill Curry -- fired.
Hal Mumme -- fired because of probation.
Guy Morriss -- left for Baylor $$.
Rich Brooks -- re-retired.
Joker Phillips -- ???

Since John Ray, there has really only been one UK coach that was terminated for lack of on-field performance, Bill Curry. All the others either left of their own accord, retired from coaching, or brought their demise upon themselves. Joker would make only the second coach in the last 40 years at UK to be fired for non-performance.

There are exceptions like Chris Petersen and Bronco Mendenhall, but most coaches that are competitive enough to put a winner on the field are also pretty competitive about wanting to prove their mettle in their chosen profession. We might not be quite a destination job, but we're still a couple of notches above UC.

ColonelSteve
10-16-2012, 04:38 PM
Leach is struggling at Washington State. Basically the same team UK is (different way, but similar results. Sagarin has them within 0.3 points of each other).

Doesn't mean he's not a good coach, or wouldn't do well here. Don't think this is the year to get him, though.

I wasn't a fan of Sonny Dykes, but he grew on me while watching the game last night. What could he do with better talent?

Willie Taggert is doing a good job. But do we take a flyer on a guy just because he is at a mid-major and seems to be overperforming in the short term?

I think the guy UK needs is a guy with NFL experience. I don't know who that is. Doesn't have to be a NFL head coach. Just somebody that knows how they do it there, has contacts there, understands the business of football.

Yes he's struggling, but it's also his first year, and the first year is always a waste when you completely change the style of play. Sonny Dykes might be a good hire, I turned off the game when Tech was getting blown out and was surprised to see they came back and made a game out of it, could turn out to be a decent hire. And the NFL thing isnt a good measure of how good a coach really is, yes it could turn out to be like Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Pete Carroll or even Rich Brooks, but it could also turn out like Cam Cameron, Dave Wandstadt, or god forbid Bill Curry, the NFL isnt really a good measuring stick for coaches unless you have a Super Bowl ring to flash to recruits

ColonelSteve
10-16-2012, 04:41 PM
I think Taggart is a pipe dream. He's a "Western guy" and right now that's a better job. Pains me to say it but true. He may leave his alma mater for a better job someday but Kentucky ain't it.


Oh please, if Kentucky offers then he would be stupid not to take it, unless of course someone like Auburn is offering him the same job, then it would be understandable. But you can NOT do the job that he has done in 3 short years and not be in high demand. Personally, I think if Kentucky passed on him they would be repeating the mistake they made passing up Roy Kidd in the 80s, yes we were alright in the 80s, but Kidd retired in 2002 which means we would have possibly avoiding the Bill Curry debacle...assuming he stayed and was successful, which given his record at EKU I dont see why he wouldnt have been.

ColonelSteve
10-16-2012, 04:43 PM
Okay, I have heard Jones discussed as a possible UK coach. I have to ask why would he leave UC for UK?

And, do you think he is a candidate for a better job?

Never forget, we may be Kentucky but we're still in the SEC and coaching in the SEC no matter what, is a dream come true for many coaches.

ColonelSteve
10-16-2012, 04:44 PM
You're starting to sound like one of those OTIS fans now Bad, the ones that like to try to get a little dig in at UK as some sort of coaching graveyard. But is it any more true at UK than at anyplace else? Going only back to Curci:

Fran Curci -- eventually fired after probation, but had more success at UK than anyone since Bear Bryant.
Jerry Claiborne -- retired from coaching.
Bill Curry -- fired.
Hal Mumme -- fired because of probation.
Guy Morriss -- left for Baylor $$.
Rich Brooks -- re-retired.
Joker Phillips -- ???

Since John Ray, there has really only been one UK coach that was terminated for lack of on-field performance, Bill Curry. All the others either left of their own accord, retired from coaching, or brought their demise upon themselves. Joker would make only the second coach in the last 40 years at UK to be fired for non-performance.

There are exceptions like Chris Petersen and Bronco Mendenhall, but most coaches that are competitive enough to put a winner on the field are also pretty competitive about wanting to prove their mettle in their chosen profession. We might not be quite a destination job, but we're still a couple of notches above UC.

Are you sure about Fran Curci? Wasnt he allowed to coach at least 3-4 years after we were placed on probation?

ColonelSteve
10-16-2012, 04:50 PM
From Wikipedia

Kentucky

In 1997, Sonny Dykes served as a graduate assistant and tight ends coach at Kentucky under head coach Hal Mumme. The season highlight was a win over #20 Alabama,[2][3] a team Kentucky had not beaten since 1922.[4] Led by sophomore quarterback Tim Couch, Kentucky's offense set multiple school, SEC, and NCAA records.[5]

Dykes returned to Kentucky in 1999 to serve on Mumme's staff as wide receivers coach and special teams coordinator. The season highlights were a victory over #20 Arkansas and a trip to the Music City Bowl. At Kentucky, Dykes coached James Whalen who earned consensus All-America honors and set the all-time NCAA Division I record for receptions by a tight end. Whalen was selected in the fifth-round of the 2000 NFL Draft by the Dallas Cowboys. Dykes also coached wide receiver Quentin McCord who was selected in the seventh-round of the 2001 NFL Draft by the Atlanta Falcons. Two of Dykes' players, Derek Smith and Brad Pyatt, signed as undrafted free agents with the Indianapolis Colts in 2002 and 2003, respectively.

ColonelSteve
10-16-2012, 05:01 PM
Sonny Dykes-Louisiana Tech
Career Record 18-13
317.7 Passing YPG (14th), 221.0 Rushing YPG (21st), Points scored 53.8 (1st), Points given up 39.7 (117th)

Pros: Has proven a valuable assistant at Kentucky and Texas Tech, has recruited and coached NFL talent at UK and has shown he can turn a program around in a short time and make them conference champions...even though its the WAC, has an offense that Kentucky fans have loved and will sell out Commonwealth every game, unlike Mumme, he has shown he can not only pass the ball but run the ball as well, a HUGE key in succeeding in the SEC.

Cons: Like Mumme, its obvious by the points given up that he cares about offense only, something you cant do to win in this conference, this year he has given up 49 to Houston, 37 to Rice, 24 to Illinois, 38 to Virginia, 31 to UNLV and 59 to Texas A&M, none of these schools are offensive powerhouses, what is going to happen when we play Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, Alabama, LSU and Arkansas among others?

ColonelSteve
10-16-2012, 05:10 PM
Butch Jones- Cincinnati
Career Record- 46-24
Passing YPG 244.8 (53rd), Rushing YPG 220.6 (23rd), Points scored 37.0 (27th), Points given up 14.4 (10th)

Pros: In 5 full years of coaching, he has won 3 conference championships, 2 in the MAC at Central Michigan, and tied for the Big East last year at Cincinnati. Like Dykes he has a balanced attack, while not as explosive, it is still effective. He has Michigan and Ohio recruiting ties and for Kentucky to succeed, that is HUGE. Even a 3 star out of this area, is better than what we've been given, however will the style the high schools play up their in the Big 10 style of play prove successful in the SEC, probably not since the SEC is all about SPEED.

Cons: Cincinnati is 5-0 this year, against two FCS teams, Pittsburgh, Virginia Tech and Miami(OH), that is not impressive, the stats are a little skewed when you look at the competition, but hey...at least he hasnt lost to Western Kentucky, so what do we have to lose? While he has recruiting ties, ESPN shows that his highest rated player in the class of 2013 is a 78, but again, compare that to Kentucky whos highest rated recruit is a 79, if recruiting is an issue, this may not be the way to go, but then again, it's much easier to recruit to the SEC then it is the dying Big East, who knows?

Catfan73
10-17-2012, 12:05 PM
Are you sure about Fran Curci? Wasnt he allowed to coach at least 3-4 years after we were placed on probation?

I said eventually. Curci believed he was fired because he was perceived as a threat to basketball's supremacy, not because of his on-field record. Cliff Hagan waited four seasons after the 10-1 year to terminate him, but it came after 4 years of "de-emphasizing" football at UK, making those wins that much harder to come by.

I can put people into very difficult situations in which to succeed and then blame them when they don't. I think this was part of Curci's complaint.

Catfan73
10-17-2012, 12:08 PM
Colonel, go look up Chuck Martin, currently Notre Dame's offensive coordinator.

Darrell KSR
10-17-2012, 02:47 PM
Butch Jones- Cincinnati
Career Record- 46-24
Passing YPG 244.8 (53rd), Rushing YPG 220.6 (23rd), Points scored 37.0 (27th), Points given up 14.4 (10th)

Pros: In 5 full years of coaching, he has won 3 conference championships, 2 in the MAC at Central Michigan, and tied for the Big East last year at Cincinnati. Like Dykes he has a balanced attack, while not as explosive, it is still effective. He has Michigan and Ohio recruiting ties and for Kentucky to succeed, that is HUGE. Even a 3 star out of this area, is better than what we've been given, however will the style the high schools play up their in the Big 10 style of play prove successful in the SEC, probably not since the SEC is all about SPEED.

Cons: Cincinnati is 5-0 this year, against two FCS teams, Pittsburgh, Virginia Tech and Miami(OH), that is not impressive, the stats are a little skewed when you look at the competition, but hey...at least he hasnt lost to Western Kentucky, so what do we have to lose? While he has recruiting ties, ESPN shows that his highest rated player in the class of 2013 is a 78, but again, compare that to Kentucky whos highest rated recruit is a 79, if recruiting is an issue, this may not be the way to go, but then again, it's much easier to recruit to the SEC then it is the dying Big East, who knows?

When your "Cons" is that you've beaten everyone you've played and you're undefeated, I can live with those kind of "cons" :).

I don't know what kind of recruiting he could do in the SEC. I suspect better than the Big East, but I dunno.

ColonelSteve
10-17-2012, 04:20 PM
Chuck Martin- Notre Dame Offensive Coordinator
Per NCAA.org
Total Offense -76th (UK-113th) (Florida, South Carolina, Vandy, Mizzou, UK and Auburn are all SEC teams ranked lower than ND)
Total Yards- 2326 (UK 2145)
Total Plays/Yards per play 409/5.69 (UK 442/4.85)
Touchdowns 19 (UK 17)
Total Yards per game 387.67 (UK 306.43)

3rd down Conversion
ND- #52 34/79 43.04
UK- #57 41/98 41.84

4th down Conversion
ND- T57 2/4 50%
UK- T117(last) 0/10 0%

First Down Offense
ND- T57
63- Rushing
53- Passing
13- Penalty
129- Total
21.5 Per Game

Kentucky -105
40- Rushing
72- Passing
12- Penalty
124- Total
17.71 Per Game

Passing Offense
ND- 86th
100/167 59.88% 3 INTs
1239 Passing Yards
7.42 Yards Per Attempt
13 TD
206.5 YPG
1.8 INT%
12.39 Yards Per Completion

Kentucky 93rd
142/244 58.2%
9 INTs
1397 Passing Yards
5.73 YPA
10 TDs
199.57 YPG
3.69 INT%
9.84 YPC

Rushing
ND 47th
242 attempts, 1087 yards, 4.49 YPC, 13 TDs 181.17 YPG

Kentucky 106th
198 attempts, 748 yards, 3.78 YPC, 7 TDs, 106.86 YPG

Red Zone Offense
ND- T-72nd
29 drives, 23 scores, 123 RZ Points, 11 Rushing TDs, 3 Passing, 9 FGs, 79%

Kentucky- 107th
16 drives, 11 scores, 73 points, 4 Rushing TDs, 6 Passing, 1 FG, 69%

Tackles for Loss Allowed
Notre Dame- T-33rd
23 Opponents Solor TFL, 12 Opp Assist TFL, 107 Opponents TFL yards, 29.0 Opp TOT TFL(?), 4.83 Opp TOT TFL/gm

Kentucky- T62nd
35 Opponents Solo TFL, 8 Opp Assist TFL, 167 Opponents TFL yards, 39.0 Opp TOT TFL(?), 5.57 Opp TOT TFL/gm

Turnovers Lost
ND- T19 7
UK- T57 11

Not glamorous but certainly much better than were at, also it needs to be noted that up until this year, Martin was a defensive coach

http://www.und.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/martin_chuck00.html

ColonelSteve
10-17-2012, 04:20 PM
When your "Cons" is that you've beaten everyone you've played and you're undefeated, I can live with those kind of "cons" :).

I don't know what kind of recruiting he could do in the SEC. I suspect better than the Big East, but I dunno.

Kent State beat everybody but Kentucky, sorry but Im not impressed with them

ColonelSteve
10-17-2012, 08:33 PM
BTW its report like THIS that scares me about this move...the longer Mitch waits, the worse it could be for us...we need to get going and going FAST

2. Continuing to hear from NFL assistant coaches that Nick Saban is ready for a return to the NFL. If he did want to make a pro comeback, don't be so sure he would be the hottest commodity. His tenure in Miami ended so badly there would be questions about whether he could be trusted if things went badly.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/20576691/tenpoint-stance-failing-to-find-franchise-qb-dooms-holmgren-in-cleveland

Catfan73
10-18-2012, 05:22 PM
I didn't say go look up Notre Dame's offensive stats. I said go look up Chuck Martin.

Badinage
10-19-2012, 02:03 AM
73, I look at your coaching list for UK and I see very little that would attract a young coach. The best selling point is probably the fact that the Brooks tenure demonstrated that having bowl seasons means the coach is having success and will be retained. Assuming we really would pay top flight money, THAT fact may be the most compelling argument for an up and coming young talent.

Darrell KSR
10-19-2012, 11:19 AM
Kent State beat everybody but Kentucky, sorry but Im not impressed with them

and Darrell Hazell is doing a heckuva job, too.

When your "con" is that you're undefeated, it's a pretty weak con. Just is.

suncat05
10-19-2012, 06:14 PM
When it's all said and done, does it really matter? No matter who we hire to replace CJP, in the end we will get the exact same results as we have almost every other time we've fired one coach and hired another. The same, exact results.
Until the UKAA and the powers-that-be start spending the needed finances for the football program and doing the other things that some of our other SEC bretheren do to be competitive, then maybe, just maybe we'll actually win some SEC games and be somewhat respected.
But until that happens, I am not spending one red cent or doing anything else besides watching on TV. I am not going to another game until we can compete with the likes of Florida, Tennessee, Georgia, etc., etc., etc. It is not worth the time or the aggravation, so I am not spending my hard earned money to support a never-ending losing propostion. I've had it! Enough is enough, and I have had about 58 years worth of it.
To hell with the UKAA and whoever else it is that does not want Kentucky football to succeed!! :mad:

ColonelSteve
10-19-2012, 07:27 PM
I didn't say go look up Notre Dame's offensive stats. I said go look up Chuck Martin.

I mean his only head coaching experience came at Grand Valley State, and I really had a hard time finding anything on it, his offense scheme there was effective but the ND website made it clear that before this year he was a defensive coach before he switched it up to the offense, I really didnt know how to explain it then to put his stats out there, hes not a bigger name like many of the other coaches ITT

http://www.und.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/martin_chuck00.html

ColonelSteve
10-19-2012, 07:29 PM
When it's all said and done, does it really matter? No matter who we hire to replace CJP, in the end we will get the exact same results as we have almost every other time we've fired one coach and hired another. The same, exact results.
Until the UKAA and the powers-that-be start spending the needed finances for the football program and doing the other things that some of our other SEC bretheren do to be competitive, then maybe, just maybe we'll actually win some SEC games and be somewhat respected.
But until that happens, I am not spending one red cent or doing anything else besides watching on TV. I am not going to another game until we can compete with the likes of Florida, Tennessee, Georgia, etc., etc., etc. It is not worth the time or the aggravation, so I am not spending my hard earned money to support a never-ending losing propostion. I've had it! Enough is enough, and I have had about 58 years worth of it.
To hell with the UKAA and whoever else it is that does not want Kentucky football to succeed!! :mad:

Sometimes it just takes the right coach to implement that right attitude, I mean look at what Lon Kruger did at Florida, they tried to throw him under the boss too and then hired Billy Donovan who really had success at Marshall, Pitino told him NOT to take that job, he did it anyway, stuck through it and proved you can win anywhere, and now Florida takes the other sports seriously, the same can be done at UK with the right hire

Catfan73
10-20-2012, 12:54 AM
73, I look at your coaching list for UK and I see very little that would attract a young coach. The best selling point is probably the fact that the Brooks tenure demonstrated that having bowl seasons means the coach is having success and will be retained. Assuming we really would pay top flight money, THAT fact may be the most compelling argument for an up and coming young talent.

Dan Mullen was 37 when Mississippi State hired him. Ole Miss hired Hugh Freeze, 43. James Franklin is 40, in his second year at Vandy. Martin is 44.

What do you think exactly these schools had to offer young coaches that UK doesn't?

suncat05
10-20-2012, 02:41 AM
We HAD the right guy in Rich Brooks, but he retired because he ultimately saw that he was only going to be given so much and that was going to be it.
How do I know that? Look at what he did at Oregon, and look where they're at now, as opposed to where we're at now.
I'm not trying to be argumentative here with you, but it is clear that the powers-that-be @ Kentucky do not want any more than what we've achieved over the years, as opposed to what we see going on in the rest of the SEC. We had the guy that built Oregon into a program to be respected, but in the end, the powers-that-be ran him off because they do not give a damn about football!
Could that change like it did with Florida basketball? Yeah, sure it could, but from what I have witnessed over the years it is very apparent that somebody is blocking progress for the football program, that is the way it has always been, and it is not going to change.

suncat05
10-20-2012, 02:56 AM
And to follow up on my previous post, you also have to look at what did not happen when Jerry Claiborne retired........Kentucky DID NOT hire the best man to replace CJC. We hired Bill Curry and did not give him the tools he needed. And while I am not a big Bill Curry fan, if you look at his record he has been successful everywhere else that he has coached. That is when we had an opportunity to hire Howard Schnellenberger, and once again, the powers-that-be screwed it up and hired the wrong guy. Why? Because they DO NOT want football to be successful at Kentucky.
At least that is how I see it. They keep doing the same exact stuff over and over again, knowing that ultimately whoever is the football coach is going to fail. Then it's "rinse-n-repeat" all over again, with the same damn results.
I am sick and tired of seeing Kentucky football fail, but the only power I have to use that might change things is if I do not spend any money in support of a failing proposition. So that is what I have chosen to do, and if others would do the same thing it would send a very clear message. But alas......... we have fans who will support ANYTHING as long as they get to tailgate and get drunk on autumn Saturday afternoons. :mad:

bluesuedeshoes
10-20-2012, 09:50 AM
Then it's "rinse-n-repeat" all over again, with the same damn results.


Hey, THAT could be our new slogan! :p

Dogsoldier202
10-22-2012, 07:04 PM
Dont know how this affects us but since I live on the KY/TN border i hear alot of UT stuff on Nashville Radio Stations.. Currently in UT land the top three candidates for the UT job are this Jon Gruden and yes he has said he would be interested in talking with UT. Charlie Strong and Bobby Petrino. Or at least this is the list coming out of rumor land there...

Badinage
10-26-2012, 12:43 PM
Belotti?

Dogsoldier202
10-27-2012, 10:26 PM
There will be probably 4 SEC teams looking for Head Coaches next season, what is the bet that UK comes out with the the least impressive hire.

Badinage
10-29-2012, 12:10 PM
Kelly parlayed the UC job into a job at Notre Dame. Jones may not have had the same success as Kelly at UC, but I would suspect that he would have a better pick than the UK job.

But, if the UK job is a great landing place or stepping stone for a bigger job, Mitch should be able to land us a good coach.

Let's wait and see...

BTW, Belotti and Jay Gruden have been bantered about, as well.

suncat05
10-29-2012, 12:35 PM
I've also heard Jack Del Rio's name mentioned, but I think that's grasping at straws. He's a genuine old school tough guy, but I seriously doubt that he'd do more than politely listen to the pitch. It'd be great if we could get him, but I won't hold my breath on it.

wWilly
10-29-2012, 04:58 PM
Chuck was DC when Brian Kelly won his last National Title at Grand Valley. Chuck became head coach and ran the offense. Look at his offensive numbers there. He went to three National title games and won two. The guy is a heck of a recruiter and knows both sides of the ball.