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View Full Version : Obama Exec Order bans importation of rifles never used in crimes



CitizenBBN
08-29-2013, 01:04 PM
Two new orders today from King Obama the First.

One bans re-importation of US military guns lent/sold to other nations. Long story short, there is demand among gun collectors and owners for WWII vintage rifles, specifically the M1 Garand and M1 Carbine. There are about a million of them sitting in South Korea, guns we left for the SK government at the end of the Korean war. The SK government is willing to sell those guns to private companies who want to re-import them to the US for sale to civilians.

ATF had approved the importation a few years ago, but Hillary personally blocked it through the Dept. of State. This order bans that from happening outright.

For those unfamiliar, the M1 Garand is a WWII rifle, the standard rifle of US troops in both WWII and most of the Korean War. It is long, heavy, shoots a round bigger and heavier and more expensive than any assault rifle's. It doesn't even have a removable magazine, you have to load it from the top of the gun and holds 8 rounds. The M1 Carbine is smaller and does have removable mags, and is an "assault rifle" in California, but it too is 50+ year old technology and is prized mostly by collectors and WWII buffs. it shoots the rather expensive .30 Cal round, and as far as I know has never been involved in any gang land shooting.

These guns are not used in crimes, have not been favored by lunatics in shooting sprees (I don't know of any use of them except probably the shooter at U Texas in the 60s), and thus this ban does nothing to reduce gun crime.

Chicago has hired 100s of people to escort kids across gang borders to school, hoping it identifies to the gangs that these aren't rival members crossing their borders, and his big anti-gun violence move is to ban importation of some rifles that these gangs have never seen or used ever. Makes his stance on Syria look bold and swift doesn't it?

Oh, he also is requiring fingerprints and reviews of people putting guns into gun trusts. This is done mostly for NFA class weapons, and while I don't oppose that process, it's another bold move to stop something that isn't a problem. The cheapest NFA weapons start at $3K or so, most are $15K or even $30K and up. People paying lawyers to set up LLCs and transferring these guns as part of their estate planning aren't a big part of the drive by shooting problem and they aren't knocking over liquor stores. It again does nothing to really help anyone.

So very Obama. Hold a press conference to announce a tough new stand on something that means nothing and improves no one's safety or quality of life and pat yourself on the back for your bold step.

The good news is that executive orders are easily reversed if we can just get a person with a functioning brain in the office in 2 years. I'm all for reducing gun violence in this country, who isn't? How about we focus on the things actually CAUSING that gun violence and not on some 60 year old rifles that have probably been used in so few crimes in the last 60 years you could count them on your fingers?

Doc
08-29-2013, 06:44 PM
One bans re-importation of US military guns lent/sold to other nations.

Does this mean we can't buy back all those guns that went to Mexico during "Fast and Furious"?

CitizenBBN
08-29-2013, 07:22 PM
Does this mean we can't buy back all those guns that went to Mexico during "Fast and Furious"?

It's being debated now Doc b/c it seems to cover just private companies. So if the ATF wanted to buy them back they could, but a private company couldn't import them. ;)


Your post reminds me of what is probably the funniest part of all this, and the clearest evidence of its absurdity. The Civilian Marksmanship Program (CMP) was created by act of Congress in 1903 and run by the Army until 1996 (now a non profit corporation created by Congress), and for that entire time it has been directly responsible for selling these exact guns from US stockpiles to civilians as part of teaching civilian marksmanship and safety.

He just banned importation of guns that have been, by force of law, distributed as the ideal guns on which to learn basic marksmanship and gun safety. Politicians since 1903 have seen it as a completely normal and advantageous thing for civilians to be able to have one of these rifles, but now Obama and Biden claim they are part of the gun violence problem in the US.

People aren't immediately sure if this shuts down the CMP or not. For some time they've obtained these guns by re-importing from foreign stockpiles b/c the US just doesn't have a lot of M1 Garands in inventory these days. The gun hasn't been issued to troops since the 1950s as a main battle weapon.

This order also bans even older WWI era guns, also popular with CMP participants. Those are bolt action rifles like the Springfield 1903 rifle. You don't see a lot of gang bangers hanging out of car windows shooting up rival hangouts with that kind of gun.

Sheer stupidity.

dan_bgblue
08-29-2013, 09:08 PM
Wish I knew for sure who is paying him to enact such a stupid law. There is a money trail, but it is one you and I will never get a chance to follow.

CitizenBBN
08-29-2013, 11:16 PM
Wish I knew for sure who is paying him to enact such a stupid law. There is a money trail, but it is one you and I will never get a chance to follow.

It's a good question. the situation with South Korea started bc they were trying to raise money for their military. They have a million or so of these things sitting around, realized that inventory was worth a lot of money. The Obama Admin initially seemed OK with the deal, they'd agreed with SK that it would be a sale over a 10 year period to spread out the importation.

I'm not sure if it's money or just the anti-gunners got to them. One theory I've seen is that they're afraid of the M1 Carbine. ATF submitted docs apparently suggesting they can be made full auto and could be used in crimes. They seem to ignore the millions of them already in the US for which that hasn't happened. Another theory is they worry about it opening the gates to the millions more of these that are out there including handguns like 1911s. I've got reason to believe ATF has been dragging its feet on regular importations for some time.

This could be just another way to keep guns out of the country to the anti-gunners. Any gun is a bad gun, and you wave M1 carbines (which meet Feinstein's idea of an "assault rifle" with the detachable mag) and pistols at them and it could be they just see a chance to ban a class of weapons from coming in and will take it. Hard to constrict domestic production but they can do a lot to slow imports without Congressional action.

Like you though I wonder if it isn't to prevent the competition in the market, but I really doubt any gun maker is supporting Obama even on this issue. Could it be the European Union not wanting the competition for the US market? That seems to contradict the import constriction strategy. I'll be curious to see what is written about it in the next week or so.

dan_bgblue
08-30-2013, 06:34 AM
It could be any of those scenarios or it could be as simple as Soros or Bloomberg writing a check and saying Barry you need to take care of this. Like I said, I do not think we will ever know. Should also say that I may be completely off base, and the socialist in him is just plain afraid of an armed citizenry and he will chip away at that potential anyway he can.

badrose
08-30-2013, 07:24 AM
It could be any of those scenarios or it could be as simple as Soros or Bloomberg writing a check and saying Barry you need to take care of this. Like I said, I do not think we will ever know. Should also say that I may be completely off base, and the socialist in him is just plain afraid of an armed citizenry and he will chip away at that potential anyway he can.

Bingo! (IMO)

CitizenBBN
08-30-2013, 08:54 AM
It could be any of those scenarios or it could be as simple as Soros or Bloomberg writing a check and saying Barry you need to take care of this. Like I said, I do not think we will ever know. Should also say that I may be completely off base, and the socialist in him is just plain afraid of an armed citizenry and he will chip away at that potential anyway he can.

The man said "those people who cling to their guns and religion". I don't think you're stretching to surmise he sees us as a backward impediment to the direction he wants this country to go, and I have no doubt he thinks it would go that way easier if we didn't have our guns to cling to.

KeithKSR
08-30-2013, 04:19 PM
Does this mean we can't buy back all those guns that went to Mexico during "Fast and Furious"?

Those guns are probably ok, as they were used in a crime or crimes. One of which was the illegal gun walking scheme. The government and its agents are not exempt from following federal law.

KeithKSR
08-30-2013, 04:21 PM
The man said "those people who cling to their guns and religion". I don't think you're stretching to surmise he sees us as a backward impediment to the direction he wants this country to go, and I have no doubt he thinks it would go that way easier if we didn't have our guns to cling to.
I guess he considers the Robertson family, of Duck Dynasty fame, to be terrorists. They all about religion, guns, capitalism and old fashioned family values; all the things Obama despises.